CIA Waterboarded Mohammed 183X in 1 Month, Zubaydah 83X in 1 month

[Friday on my mind]

I have some vids for you of how criminal scum should be dealt with
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyhM6FlsJhs&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bw94nN5qc_M&feature=related part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASdauLWH9SQ&feature=related part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9SWG1f--GY&feature=related part 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7X3pRkRfTg&feature=related part 4
I will post another batch of vids just for you.

I watched part of the 1st one,get the idea lol.What does that have to do with the torture of people in custody?
Now here is a video of the police in action that does relate to that.

How NYPD torture people

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0phtQgBKIqc

Reminiscent of the police and their smack down of Rodney King,just not as lengthy.

 

[Hot Mega]

I hope I would have the strength NOT to waterboard someone no matter what the circumstances. Even if my own Grandparents would be murdered otherwise. I hope I would stand up for principles.

Wow...that's a pretty simple, moral decision for me. If water boarding (or worse) some criminal automatically equated to the saving of an innocent person's life, I'm not sure how that decision is even debatable.

Cops (for example) use deadly force to protect themselves and the innocent from imminent threats all the time.

But there is no evidence that kind of imminent circumstance was present in the cases this thread is about.

 

[georges]

I watched part of the 1st one,get the idea lol.What does that have to do with the torture of people in custody?
Now here is a video of the police in action that does relate to that.

How NYPD torture people

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0phtQgBKIqc

Reminiscent of the police and their smack down of Rodney King,just not as lengthy.

You picture law enforcement people as bad guys but coming from you it is not astonishing. You think most of cops are bad. You should stop putting people in the same basket. In custody, you have gangs and other low lives that kill each other and that injury new detainees, I was sure you knew that but unfortunately not. Be thankful if one day your life will be saved by a cop. Perhaps for you, it is preferable to be saved by a gang member?:1orglaugh :laugh:

 

[Friday on my mind]

You picture law enforcement people as bad guys but coming from you it is not astonishing. You think most of cops are bad. You should stop putting people in the same basket. In custody, you have gangs and other low lives that kill each other and that injury new detainees, I was sure you knew that but unfortunately not. Be thankful if one day your life will be saved by a cop. Perhaps for you, it is preferable to be saved by a gang member?:1orglaugh :laugh:

Lets be clear I think majority of police do the right thing and act correctly,but thats not news when they do as they should and it shouldn't be as thats what we expect.
It is you that wish to overlook the wrong things they do sometimes as well as the wrong things goverments do.YOU lump people into a basket of accused of something you must be guilty of something and therefore whatever happens to you is ok.
America is suppose to stand for justice and due process and the presumption of innocent until found guilty by a trial.When that is disregarded all americans should be concerned as should all people everywhere of conscience.

 

[Hot Mega]

You picture law enforcement people as bad guys but coming from you it is not astonishing. You think most of cops are bad.

Point taken "georges".

What I don't get is how some who think similarly to some of what you've posted here got all up in arms when David Koresh causes the death of all those innocent people on his compound by ordering his people to fire on law enforcement serving a duly authorized warrant.....but say zip about an innocent man shot at 50 plus times for pulling his wallet out or an inebriated teenager girl getting shot 40 times for being passed out in her car with a gun on her lap.

 

[georges]

I will post more
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tw-PmIIC9hY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJdVqkkW4Wc&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tw-PmIIC9hY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCz9d2Agi0g&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vuelutsk3M&feature=related

 

[Hot Mega]

I will post more
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tw-PmIIC9hY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJdVqkkW4Wc&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tw-PmIIC9hY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCz9d2Agi0g&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vuelutsk3M&feature=related

What do those have to do with this thread??

 

[georges]

Lets be clear I think majority of police do the right thing and act correctly,but thats not news when they do as they should and it shouldn't be as thats what we expect.
It is you that wish to overlook the wrong things they do sometimes as well as the wrong things goverments do.YOU lump people into a basket of accused of something you must be guilty of something and therefore whatever happens to you is ok.
America is suppose to stand for justice and due process and the presumption of innocent until found guilty by a trial.When that is disregarded all americans should be concerned as should all people everywhere of conscience.

Criminals are criminals and some of them are long time law brakers like this guy
http://www.amw.com/fugitives/brief.cfm?id=65192 john floyd thomas known as west side rapist involved possibly over a dozen of murders. When you have solid evidence and proofs against a suspect because of his past actions like assault with a deadly weapon, murder charges, racketeering, aiding and abetting in crime of escape, malicious murder with a weapon, rico charges, attempted murder, felony interference with custody, custodial interference, use of a firearm in commission of a felony, homicide, carrying a firearm without a license, unlawful flight to avoid prosecution, aggravated robbery with a deadly weapon and assault with a deadly weapon against a police officer, then the suspect is guilty and can't be proven as innocent. US Marshals who work alongwith many police departments have files on dangerous criminals. Many times suspects are researched by many police departments for many charges.
Let's talk about the black mafia
http://www.amw.com/features/feature_story_detail.cfm?id=818 involved in money laundering and drugs distribution. One of their scumbag is still wanted
http://www.amw.com/fugitives/brief.cfm?id=64850. Anyone who has a criminal record like this guy is not innocent but is guilty.
Before claiming someone is innocent, look at their record in order to see whether they are really innocent and have nothing to reproach themselves or are guilty of criminals charges in their past.

 

[Boothbabe]

What exactly does all of this have to do with the CIA waterboarding people?

 

[georges]

Point taken "georges".

What I don't get is how some who think similarly to some of what you've posted here got all up in arms when David Koresh causes the death of all those innocent people on his compound by ordering his people to fire on law enforcement serving a duly authorized warrant.....but say zip about an innocent man shot at 50 plus times for pulling his wallet out or an inebriated teenager girl getting shot 40 times for being passed out in her car with a gun on her lap.

You have some crooked cops who only use the badge to mean that they are above others, that exist too and I am aware of it. Do you honestly that think that crooked cops don't get punished or are not fired if they are going against the ethics of their police department????
I can't belove how naive you are. Not all cops are abusing of their authority, put yourself in the shoes of cops and the people they have to deal with.

 

[georges]

What exactly does all of this have to do with the CIA waterboarding people?

It has one common thing, that some people here on this board claim that law enforcement agencies use torture as cia does against suspects. I would like to see how you handle a dangerous felon with peaceful methods.

 

[Boothbabe]

Do you honestly that think that crooked cops don't get punished or are not fired if they are going against the ethics of their police department?

There still exsists a very big "looking out for our own" mentality within police departments, not only in the US but in the Netherlands as well. I think everyone would be shocked if we knew how much corruption and abuse of power there really is in law enforcement.

 

[Facial_King]

There still exsists a very big "looking out for our own" mentality within police departments, not only in the US but in the Netherlands as well. I think everyone would be shocked if we knew how much corruption and abuse of power there really is in law enforcement.

...b-b-b-but georges got that signed letter from the producer of "COPS" telling him that internal investigations all but eliminate corruption, abuse of power, and police brutality issues within law enforcement. Father declares father to be innocent!

:1orglaugh

 

[Hot Mega]

TI think everyone would be shocked if we knew how much corruption and abuse of power there really is in law enforcement.

"georges" has never heard of the "thin, blue line" I guess.

Not all cops are abusing of their authority, put yourself in the shoes of cops and the people they have to deal with.

I DID! When they are serving a warrant on a well armed compound (as in the Koresh case) it would have been criminally negligent to not show up with enough force to protect themselves. And they were right as the Branch Davidians fired upon them. What was the BATF and FBI supposed to do?? Just say, oh well...we'll let him get away with it because right wingers will overreact if we take them down???

 

[meesterperfect]

I hope I would have the strength NOT to waterboard someone no matter what the circumstances. Even if my own Grandparents would be murdered otherwise. I hope I would stand up for principles.

when then you are a very very heartless person.

but at least you and one other had the balls to answer my question.

 

[meesterperfect]

Now all you have to do is demonstrated there was an imminent threat to the life of some specific kid in order for your hypothetical to be relevant to this discussion.

well lets see, the guy already killed a few thousand people several years earlier, i think its a safe assumption to think he just might have another plan in the works.

i would consider that a reasonable concern of imminent threat.

 

[Facial_King]

It doesn't really matter if one of us, in a personal ticking-time-bomb situation (probably about 100,000,000 times more unlikely than any of us winning a mega-lottery jackpot) would waterboard someone to save a family member. The question is, why was there a government policy to waterboard people that allowed it to happen 183X in situations that obviously were not of the ticking-bomb variety? From "innocent until proven guilty" to waterboard them if we suspect something... So damn "effective" we had to do it 183 times.

 

[Hot Mega]

well lets see, the guy already killed a few thousand people several years earlier, i think its a safe assumption to think he just might have another plan in the works.

i would consider that a reasonable concern of imminent threat.

That is about as bad a reasoning of a circumstance as could be made IMO.

When you've a suspect into custody, you've most likely interdicted whatever activity that person was engaged in.

The only way you could know of an imminent threat is if you know of it by means other than any interrogation against them. Otherwise, what questions do you know to ask of them and how would you have any idea what answer they give you is correct?

This whole ticking time bomb interrogation is something largely reserved for Hollywood.

But I understand that you're incorrigible and it doesn't matter what reason is lodged against your perspective on this, you are convinced you have a point to salvage and will continue to prop up specious, irrelevant arguments.

 

[BioDefenseGrad]

Bingo! My point exactly. This thing was GOP ginned up and strictly political...it may have had it's own legs..but clearly (to anyone with common sense) to the extent they exploited others....this is all about the GOP reaching for traction against Obama.

After all, before this spending and these crisisis....we had record supplemental spending and a growing crisis in Iraq...where was Fox and the usual suspects then???

Ginned up means purely created by a political party without basis in the grassroots right?

That's not true at all. Like I said this has happened during Tax Day for years.
If they have EVEN LESS of a say in how their tax money is spent (yet they continue to pay most of the taxes) no wonder it's gotten more attention. If I was a Fox News editor, I'd see a story in that. And seeing that most of the media is liberal controlled, you're basically guaranteed a sizeable audience if you're the one who devotes coverage to it.


Did you see how condescending the CNN folks were? It's funny how it backfired on that one "reporter" Susan Roesgen.

And if Obama is outspending the GOP in a matter of months, they are now supposed to be quiet about it...Clearly you don't recognize the difference between conservatives and the GOP as a whole. It's like telling liberals not to protest because Obama decided against immediate 10 month withdrawal and has left a loophole open for continued combat troops past the deadline if things head south.

I guess they should stfu, because the Dems are in charge now, right? These folks can do whatever the hell they want to do. It's up to their party to respond to them, because this is where the votes lie. These are the folks who go out and campaign for you, who drum up support. When you don't listen, they stay home. Which is what happened to the GOP the last 2 election cycles.


So tell me why are Republicans wrong for protesting massive spending by President Obama? Why are Conservatives wrong?

Has it worked so far with Chrysler? That company is in the toilet and now it's looked like money wasted.

 

[BioDefenseGrad]

It doesn't really matter if one of us, in a personal ticking-time-bomb situation (probably about 100,000,000 times more unlikely than any of us winning a mega-lottery jackpot) would waterboard someone to save a family member. The question is, why was there a government policy to waterboard people that allowed it to happen 183X in situations that obviously were not of the ticking-bomb variety? From "innocent until proven guilty" to waterboard them if we suspect something... So damn "effective" we had to do it 183 times.

Aren't you supposed to be banned?