no, i'm not refering to you. just a general comment on society, not anyone in this thread or the board. I'd rather have everyone disagree with me because that's what they feel is right, than have everyone agree with me because they feel like they don't have a choice.
Sergeant in trouble for Playboy spread
- Thread starter Priapus
- Start date
no, i'm not refering to you. just a general comment on society, not anyone in this thread or the board. I'd rather have everyone disagree with me because that's what they feel is right, than have everyone agree with me because they feel like they don't have a choice.
I don't want to get off topic, but as far as flag burning goes it's one of those things I don't like personally but I will defend your right to do it. It is something I think is an inherited right humanity has. Just because people don't like something isn't a good enough reason to limit it from being said. One of our biggest assets is our ability to criticize the government. Showing displeasure over a mere representation of it doesn't even seem as bad as actually showing displeasure for the government itself. Whatever limit of free speech there is it should never be to protect peoples' feelings from getting hurt.
I agree with what LadyLove said also. Some things people choose to be who they are, and in the process of doing that you have a higher responsibility, especially when you choose to represent more than yourself. In this case the military has rules you have to follow, but even in instances where your not legally bound I think it is the proper thing to do to conduct yourself appropriately. Even if a normal person would not bound by those rules. With greater power comes greater responsibility.
I agree with what LadyLove said also. Some things people choose to be who they are, and in the process of doing that you have a higher responsibility, especially when you choose to represent more than yourself. In this case the military has rules you have to follow, but even in instances where your not legally bound I think it is the proper thing to do to conduct yourself appropriately. Even if a normal person would not bound by those rules. With greater power comes greater responsibility.
Meanwhile, I came here just hoping to see some of her naked pics!! What was I thinking???
I'm like Facial_King, I came to see her NAKED!! I start to read some post's, and I read about burning the American Flag. Now I'm PISSED, My ancestors came her from Germany because of Religious Persecusion in 1710 to New York, then Berks Co. Pennsylvania. We have fought in EVERY WAR to protect THIS LAND, THIS COUNTY except The Spanish American War. And yes I lost Ancestors to the Enemy. I have 18 cousins and kin in this mess in Iraq & Aftganistan right now. Burn the American Flag in front of me, remember I have a Kenworth T-2000 you'll be flat as a Pancake. And for this post I most likely will get kicked out, but I can't help it this is below the belt to me!!
I don't really know what is expected of a person in her position, and how she might have agreed to act. As it is though, I can't feel sorry for her, because she wore the uniform. I don't see how a person in the military could do that, and not expect it to cause some kind of problems. Besides, I think that it's completely fair for any company or institution where you wear a form of uniform in one way or another, to demand that their employees, soldiers, officers not use said uniform in a way that does not suit the image of the company or his/her superiors.
Make that another! but...
Sorry to waaaaaaaay off topic...
iamforever, with your stance on the sacredness of the flag, will you agree, when Reggie White died (yes I thought he was great too), that the Packers organization had no right to lower the American flag to half staff without permission from the Governor of Wisconsin? This goes against all national flag etiquette, btw.
Iamforever
Banned
you will never understand this fox. just give up.
yes i agree that the packers had no right to lower the flag for reggie white. reggie was one of my favorites growing up, but he wasnt important to this country at all. he wasnt a national figure. he played a game. its not like memorial day when we fly the flags low in remembering the troops that died in the various wars. this isnt like when a president dies.
:glugglug:
I saw it as offensive to many who fought, died, or served this country in some national capacity. Some argued he was a great American, contributed greatly to this country and deserved the honor. With that logic though, most of us are great Americans and deserve that honor. It really is a sacred tradition and honor that should be treated as such, in the end.
Second, flag burning is wrong, but it should never be outlawed, imo. Congress just tried to pass a constitutional amendment banning flag burning. It failed. Honestly, I'm glad that it did. They have just taken too many of our rights away in the past few years. Time to stop the insanity..
I'm wondering about what the problem is with this. Is it inappropriate to lower the flag for someone besides presidents and such, or is it just when corporations do it, that it can be seen as offensive?
My personal view is that a flag represent a country is one way or another. What I've never understood is the people who would burn or desecrate a country's flag in protest against it's government or military. To me, a flag is more a symbol of the country as a whole. It's values, culture and way of life. I do not view it as a symbol of how a country's politics are or how their government is. That's why I wouldn't burn the flag of a country in protest of politics, war or whatever. That's actually also illegal here, although it's legal for us to burn or our own flag in protest of whatever we want.
I find it somewhat ironic that people talk about hurting or even killing people for burning the flag of a country that was supposedly created so that people would be allowed to do things like that.
Quite frankly, nationalism/patriotism is lost on me. It's essentially a religion. Worship of an abstract entity. Check. Holy symbol and scripture. Check. Clergy. Check. People so zealous they are willing to die for it. Check. I might be willing to die for something I truly believe in, but it'll be a cold day in hell before I die for a piece of land that someone hundreds or thousands of years ago said that he owned. All it does is erect another barrier between people to make it oh so much easier to kill each other.
Quite frankly, nationalism/patriotism is lost on me. It's essentially a religion. Worship of an abstract entity. Check. Holy symbol and scripture. Check. Clergy. Check. People so zealous they are willing to die for it. Check. I might be willing to die for something I truly believe in, but it'll be a cold day in hell before I die for a piece of land that someone hundreds or thousands of years ago said that he owned. All it does is erect another barrier between people to make it oh so much easier to kill each other.
Iamforever
Banned
its simple. you dont embrace the flag. you exploit the flag. that flag to me stands for freedom that you cant get in most countries. and, you wont die for the country that gives you those freedoms? but rest assured that you do use those freedoms.
If someone were to invade the country where I lived and said to me (and assuming I believed them) that they'll give me the exact same freedom and rights that I already have and no one will get killed unless the resist, all they are going to do is change ownership and maybe desecrate the flag a bit just for a laugh, I'll tell them to have fun and go about my business. Why should I care? I might be willing to fight if they said they'd take away my freedom and rights, but that has nothing to do with what country I live in. I certainly don't need a piece of land to tell me what to believe in or what's worth fighting for.
Iamforever
Banned
it sure as hell does. :thumbsup:
Theopolis Q. Hossenffer
I am in America, not of it.
Many things - false representation of armed service personnel is a crime.
If you are indeed armed service personnel - then wearing the uniform has rules and etiquette attached to it. For example - did you know that you can be penalized for not wearing your hat outdoors while in full uniform?
Of course, if you'd spent time in the Army, I wouldn't have to explain such mundane things to you. But what do I know? After all, I'm just a "brainwashed robot stripped of all self identity" ...
Rest assured, if a dude did it for a mag, it'd be the same thing. This isn't "sexism" - it's about conduct code.
Those same "many people" would hold this opinion no matter what - this has nothing to do with this issue (or any issue) at hand - it's just their own personal prejudice.
I like how folks reference those who disapprove of the girls behavior as "hate" - and yet come back with posts such as these.
As for flag burning? It isn't and should never be a crime.
But as I've repeatedly pointed out - rights come with responsibilities.
You have every right to say "******" - but don't be surprised at the reaction of yelling out "******" to everyone down in Harlem.
It's the same thing.
Iamforever
Banned
are you serious? what kind of punishment would one get for this? i hope not a court martial.
maybe it shouldnt be a crime, but its one of the biggest insults to a nation. not just the states. every nation.
iamforever©
No, it doesn't. A country is abstract, the values it represents is those of the people living in it. You can change the country, remove it, do anything you want to it, the values will remain the same if the people living there are still there. Patriotism is based on the assumption that a country in itself has values. While it's quite similar to a religion, there's no superior being that dictate what is right and wrong, just an entity that is composed of people's beliefs. Believing in something made by your own belief is incredibly silly, not to mention redundant. If you need a piece of land to remind you of what you believe in, then I would argue that you may not be as convinced about what's right as you think you are.
Like I said, I don't care where I live. As long as I'm happy (and in general, other people around me), it doesn't matter and I see no reason why it should.
