If your supreme law is so great why the country so screwed up? Nobody and no land is perfect but you have to be able to take a step back and face up to your failings once in a while
1 year later, Obama still blames bush
- Thread starter jasonk282
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If your supreme law is so great why the country so screwed up? Nobody and no land is perfect but you have to be able to take a step back and face up to your failings once in a while
Will E Worm
Conspiracy...
They must not be following it correctly.
Did you ever think about that?
You should be reading news online and looking around you for the evidence.
Also, it's not failing the politicians are the one failing us all.
The apathetic people who never question anything and just go along with everything aren't helping either.
There is, it's called the Libertarian party. Libertarian liberal principles is what the US was founded on.
Practically speaking though, no ideology has the solutions as fundamentalism to ideologies is the problem. Too many times is the case that people try to promote some strict adherence to some theoretical, ideological blueprint instead of what is plain and obvious pragmatism and practicality.
Some degree of all of these ideals are necessary for a country founded on principles our was founded on in order to function at it's best.
Where I'm going with this is, circumstances like "spending", "debt" or "borrowing", etc. are demagogued evil for political purposes as if the concepts are inherently bad.
They're not. No more than it is the case in the personal economies of our household budgets.
Now what you borrow to invest in is critical and that's where the politics comes in.
For example, at the end of it we will have borrowed and spent almost as much in Iraq (in less time) than the most liberal estimations for health care reform. What reasonable American would have supported borrowing and spending that much money to preemptively overthrow a country's government and rebuild that country?
But why wasn't the focus on those costs like some seem so obsessed with over health care reform? Most likely because like in many situations, the perceived necessity of some expenditure outshines the cost of it.
So in reality it's not really about cost or spending but about the perceived necessity for the expenditure...Just like in our household budgets.
Most people have no concept of what the US borrows, spends, etc. in relationship to our GDP...nor will the realities of them ever be noticed in their day to day lives. That doesn't mean we should ignore it but so called "fiscal conservatives" need to at least understand the practicality of the concepts they argue for or against.
Wake up and face reality!
Health Care debate will be LIVE on C-SPAN?
They will negotiate the final bill from the house and the senate behind closed doors!
Thread
What was happening in all of these circumstances where Congressmembers were being shouted down BEFORE any such meeting with Democrats (NOT A NEGOTIATION)? Republicans were given every opportunity to do what Obama suggested..which was come up with a better plan...they took his kindness for weakness and simply played a game of obstruction.
What do you think was happening almost all of last year?? It wasn't just on C-SPAN all the networks covered the discussion of health care and the American people not only watched but participated. Unfortunately the discussion was hijacked by obstructionists wanting to derail any constructive dialog (that's what they get for trying I guess) but you don't get to say it didn't happen.
Where were you? Looking for the last box of Lipton's?:tongue:
Will E Worm
Conspiracy...
Hot Mega :nono:
He said the debates would be public.
Not...if I don't get my way we will take them behind closed doors.
Which should never happen in America.
Closed door meetings that will affect us all.
That's wrong and I charge anyone who does that with treason against America and the citizens.
If a Republican would have done this it would be all over the news.
Not that I'm defending them either.
He said the debates would be public.
Not...if I don't get my way we will take them behind closed doors.
Which should never happen in America.
Closed door meetings that will affect us all.
That's wrong and I charge anyone who does that with treason against America and the citizens.
If a Republican would have done this it would be all over the news.
Not that I'm defending them either.
The President can have closed door meetings with anyone he wants. It has happened all the time...this has nothing to do with the C-SPAN assertion...not that facts will matter.
Secondly, check you definition of "treason".
Lastly, "if"????? Never heard of Cheney's Energy Task Force or did you have your hands over your ears on that?? You said if a republican would have done this it would have been all over the news....Will E. how do you know about Obama's meeting with Demos if it wasn't in the "news"??? Osmosis?
Every President, including Bush inherited problems. Obama, who I was hopeful for whines and doesn't take any responsibility.
I think Bush going into Iraq was a huge mistake.
I think Obama is making many of his own.
If it wasn't so sad I would enjoy watching the right and left defend their presidents who I think are bought and paid for by their special interests.
Obama, just like every president before him does what any CEO, Director, etc does.
1. Get the job and state that they can fix the issues.
2. When you realize you are in over your head, start firing people to take the blame.
3. When all else fails, blame the previous guy.
Sorry to burst people's bubbles, but this has been going for for well over a century with regards to the PotUS.
Obama was right, its time for change. Get rid of the democrat and republican parties.
1. Get the job and state that they can fix the issues.
2. When you realize you are in over your head, start firing people to take the blame.
3. When all else fails, blame the previous guy.
Sorry to burst people's bubbles, but this has been going for for well over a century with regards to the PotUS.
Obama was right, its time for change. Get rid of the democrat and republican parties.
You're right, there is no sunset on a Presidency of any kind. Everyone who ever takes over anything from anyone else inherits what's left in the wake.
The only problem we know Bush inherited was what to do with a surplus.
So the "what's left in the wake" part is where we have the issue Monica. I mean aren't we talking slider burgers in comparison to a triple Whopper with cheese??
I'm neither right nor left and most reasonable people here who (actually) read my posts on the issues can attest to that. Now admittedly I voted for Obama and would proudly do so again 700 billion times over the alternative(s). I further admit that I hammer republicans much, much more than democrats but in fairness it should be proportional to who's worse than the other. Or, less worse if you will.
You see, it's not about defending anyone it's about speaking to the reality of circumstances.
Aside from what we think now (and this may be a thread closer here, meaning nothing further to add), the fact is the title of the thread and supposition related to it's content are totally and unequivocally baseless.
If it were actually the case that Obama was blaming Bush a year later as the OP erroneously alleges we might even have something to talk about.
But the OP alleges "1 year later, Obama still blames bush" and cites a link dated March 14th which uses a statement Obama made 1 month and 2 weeks after he took office.
Amazingly enough the OP uses a quote which states clearly that the Obama statement was made on March 4th but still chose to claim a year later for some reason. Even though the post itself was generated not even at a year.
So here we are debating and some are left with the impression Obama is still blaming Bush when nothing in this thread actually backs up that claim.
So do you still want to stand by your claim that Obama merely whines and doesn't take responsibility? If so, maybe you have better evidence to support your claim than found in this thread.
Yeah, it's pathetic that such an utterly worthless thread is STILL going...
Will E Worm
Conspiracy...
"“We have been in office about nine months. We obviously believe that the prior eight years were not as effective or focused as they might have been … our challenge has been to take what we inherited…” Obama, October 2009
That is 9 months into his presidency. (I know I heard him on the news speaking on healthcare and indicated the debt he inherited as a reason to reduce waste)
I didn't understand some of the things you said, I'm not sure what your point was.
I voted for Obama and I expect more out of my leaders. I don't get it. That is my point.
Where's the link to the rest of the statement so we (I) can see it in it's entirety. Context, etc. Can you link the entire quote?
So your problem is with the word "inherited"? In other words had he simply said the debt is a a reason to reduce waste you would have been okay with it? Or can he even in some context discuss the debt?
First of all, I was making the point that presidents come into office facing varying circumstances and as such it is directly related to the things you voted for him to accomplish. It is undoubtedly his job to do but to act as if what was inherited here was no different than any other circumstance is a bit naive IMO. The other thing was to point out neither the link associated with this thread nor the OP's comments reflect what the title says.
No doubt there are naive people out there...I spoke with a woman who asked in her best English (Vietnamese) why people at her job were still getting laid off since Obama has been in office for 2 months. I suppose he could wave a wand.
Now I asked you for evidence that Obama was blaming Bush a year later...you responded with text from a alleged quote with no source. I don't doubt your claim but I would like to read it for myself in it's proper context to see if it is actually blaming Bush a year later. Well we know it's not a year later b/c a year hasn't even gotten her and by your own submission you say it was 9 months. But provide the link please.
You are spreading misinformation. You are talking about the budget deficit not the accumulated national debt. Most of the federal expenditures were already in the pipeline under W's budget. Considering Obama has to clean the mess left by W, it's a wonder it's not more expensive.
The fucking up done by GWB and his whole Republican White House and Congress was so vast and thorough that it will literally take us years to recover.
I love the nerve that conservatives have: 30+ years of their policies and ideologies of giving all the tax breaks and money and power to the big banks and big corporations (an ideology that started with Reagan) have led us into this horrible mess -- i.e. banks that come up with shady money schemes and corporations that make and sell us cheap crap and then ship jobs that make that crap overseas so they can cut costs and pad their bottom line even more -- and then when the whole thing collapses they have the audacity to complain that the other party hasn't cleaned up their mess fast enough.
I gotta hand it to them, though -- they definitely know how to manipulate voters. This is their system:
1) Get elected on the ideology that government doesn't work.
2) Once in office, do nothing.
3) When something does actually have the chance to get done, do everything in their power to fuck it up and make sure it doesn't get done.
4) After years of a government that does nothing and fucks up at every opportunity, turn back to the voters and say "see we told you government doesn't work, and the Democrats only want MORE government, so vote for us again!"
5) The idiot voting population of the U.S. gives them their wish.
I love the nerve that conservatives have: 30+ years of their policies and ideologies of giving all the tax breaks and money and power to the big banks and big corporations (an ideology that started with Reagan) have led us into this horrible mess -- i.e. banks that come up with shady money schemes and corporations that make and sell us cheap crap and then ship jobs that make that crap overseas so they can cut costs and pad their bottom line even more -- and then when the whole thing collapses they have the audacity to complain that the other party hasn't cleaned up their mess fast enough.
I gotta hand it to them, though -- they definitely know how to manipulate voters. This is their system:
1) Get elected on the ideology that government doesn't work.
2) Once in office, do nothing.
3) When something does actually have the chance to get done, do everything in their power to fuck it up and make sure it doesn't get done.
4) After years of a government that does nothing and fucks up at every opportunity, turn back to the voters and say "see we told you government doesn't work, and the Democrats only want MORE government, so vote for us again!"
5) The idiot voting population of the U.S. gives them their wish.
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