I think the point being made is that you need to take a look around the real world and those involved with professional sports. People fuck up, and people do bad things. Some go on to be greater fuck ups, others make something out of it prevail.
Vick's situation was complicated and almost classic. Lower class guy growing up in Atlanta, bad family, bad influences. LOTS of money. Its a sociological phenomenon, but it happens more than you think. Most of em just arent as publicly recognized as Vick. what he did was illegal, it wasn't just cruelty to animals, he was making millions running an illegal activity. That can not be denied. He did prison time, and although he can not erase what he did, hes clearly making a GREAT effort to make things right again. Better people in his life, smarter choices, more maturity, and more sense of reality. That takes a lot of balls.
It shouldnt be about what he did, it should be about what hes doing now to make things right.
Chris Berman did a good piece for ESPN featuring Vick...check it out...
If a standup guy like Andy Reid trusts him, then I do too. he has changed...
I know what you mean about about second chances, and - yes - everyone deserves one.
And I can see that what he did in his personal time can certainly be argued as something that could be divorced from his on the field time.
But the person that enjoyed watching animals tear each other to pieces is the person he is. That is his personality, that is his instinct and that is not someone I would want within 100 feet of me; not someone whom I want rewarding in any way for being 'good', now that he has been caught and punished.
Sure it does. The league MVP is about who does the most to help their team win. If you're not helping your team to win then you're not really a league MVP. You can have all the stats in the world but it doesn't mean shit if it doesn't result in wins.
I seriously doubt if the Eagles would have the lead in their division right now if they still had Kolb as quarterback. Michael Vick helps his team win. Same with Brady.
What about Philip Rivers, he put some serious numbers with unknown receivers too, this year.I think it's between those 3 guys the MVP belongs.I really want Vick wins it, but you can't argue about Tom "Terrific" & his dominant season.
I know what you mean about about second chances, and - yes - everyone deserves one.
And I can see that what he did in his personal time can certainly be argued as something that could be divorced from his on the field time.
But the person that enjoyed watching animals tear each other to pieces is the person he is. That is his personality, that is his instinct and that is not someone I would want within 100 feet of me; not someone whom I want rewarding in any way for being 'good', now that he has been caught and punished.
yea im not saying your wrong to judge the man. Just that instead of thinking of him as the man who enjoyed watching animals torn apart, think about waht he IS NOW not how he used to be. That was his personality. His perosnality back then was a cocky arrogant criminal.
now several years later, the man has just been incarcerated and approved to play for play by Goodell. Andy Reid shows up, and is like lets do this shit. your ideas are what vick used to be. what he is today is a charasmatic mature young man who avoids trouble vy being smart. He cant erase what he did, but certainly he can be a cbanged man
yea im not saying your wrong to judge the man. Just that instead of thinking of him as the man who enjoyed watching animals torn apart, think about waht he IS NOW not how he used to be. That was his personality. His perosnality back then was a cocky arrogant criminal.
now several years later, the man has just been incarcerated and approved to play for play by Goodell. Andy Reid shows up, and is like lets do this shit. your ideas are what vick used to be. what he is today is a charasmatic mature young man who avoids trouble vy being smart. He cant erase what he did, but certainly he can be a cbanged man
I accept that my opinion of him may seem unduly harsh. I just have a very hard time with that kind and level of cruelty.
But I'd genuinely be more than happy to be proven wrong about him. True change is a very impressive feat and deserves recognition.
At the end of the day, we are the sum of our past deeds and experiences. Over time, his crimes will become a significantly smaller part of the whole man he is to become.
I think that Brady will probably win and Vick should get some real consideration. But I think that if a quarterback's team record is important, why isn't Matt Ryan even being talked about. I don't think he should win but Atlanta has won as many games as Brady's Pats and more than Vick's Eagles. He should at least come into the discussion. :2 cents:
As he was never accused of rape or murder, the comparator is redundant and, frankly, facile. I was talking about what he did, not about the great slide rule of moral degeneracy. Hey, why not give him a free pass because he never committed genocide? he never fucked your Mom in the ass, so let's give him a medal.
The Bolts best win is probably @ Indy. Otherwise, there are some bad losses and wins over stinky teams. :dunno:
Branch was very good with the Pats, but then went to Seattle and was basically on the scrap heap. He's obviously motivated to play/win now, but he's also got You Know Who throwing him the rock again.. Just sayin'. Welker was cut loose from Miami and Danny Whitehead was a Jets castoff. Hernandez and Gronkowski are not shitty players. They're going to be studs. They both had solid college careers at Big Boy Colleges. They're just rooks now.
why isn't Matt Ryan even being talked about. I don't think he should win but Atlanta has won as many games as Brady's Pats and more than Vick's Eagles. He should at least come into the discussion. :2 cents:
It's tough to say the Falcons are 11-2 specifically because of Ryan. The best thing he's been doing is not making stupid throws near the end of games. He's a smart player but I don't know if he's the main reason the Falcons are winning.
In any event - Big Ben: no charges filed (if it's the sexual assault allegations you are thinking about), which in most civilized societies means he's innocent of wrongdoing.
Lewis was convicted of lying to cops (admittedly over a murder) a misdemeanor. Not even close to what Vick was convicted of; not even close to the level of sadistic degeneracy in the Vick case.
Apologies to all for veering a little off topic, but just to finish the above post, I suppose my question back to you would be how come the league can ban Stanley Wilson and Earl Ferrell for life for drug use (non-violent acts, and neither player was ever charged with a crime relating to their usage), but allow Vick to go back?
I'm NOT saying they were wrong: what I'm saying is that the league is inconsistent - incoherent even - with it's discipline, far too easily swayed by the politics and money that constantly threaten to completely overshadow the only thing that actually matters: the play.
(Thanks to other posters for bearing with me on this.)
It's tough to say the Falcons are 11-2 specifically because of Ryan. The best thing he's been doing is not making stupid throws near the end of games. He's a smart player but I don't know if he's the main reason the Falcons are winning.
All I was saying is he should be in the discussion. I don't think he should win. Since quarterbacks are judged by wins and losses, more so than just stats, he deserves to be in the discussion. One way to look at it: would the Falcons be here if Michael Vick had not gone to jail, and was still playing for the Falcons? I don't think that they are.
I'm NOT saying they were wrong: what I'm saying is that the league is inconsistent - incoherent even - with it's discipline, far too easily swayed by the politics and money that constantly threaten to completely overshadow the only thing that actually matters: the play.
I agree, particularly the Wins. I would also think that Ray Lewis leadership (he upgrades every player on that defense by simply being the Captain) and Jamaal Charles and the Chiefs ultimate dependency upon him could be added as well to the others mentioned.
Clearly Vick and Brady are the front runners though. My pick was Brady for those who wouldn't guess at it.
The Pro Bowl will decide whether Tom Vick or Michael Brady is the MVP, The field speaks louder than the stats or the words.I have no doubt the 2 will face each other & we'll see who's the best this year.
