The Prime Minister of israel Benjamin Netanyahu

[tvstrip]

If you are going to allow your schools to be rocket launching facilities then you are putting your schools and children at risk. As for your Tel Aviv scenario, that is within their border and would send police directly into that area and search it out on foot. Do you want Israel to cross the boarder to do the same thing? Why isn't the Palestinian National Authority doing anything to stop mortar attacks from Gaza? Do you think they are going to do anything about plugging up those tunnels into Israel?

The Israel can send in ground troops; instead, of firing artillery and dropping bombs at Hamas rockets. The Israelis haven't sent in ground troops in Gaza City and other highly populated areas. The Israeli casualty rate would skyrocket, but the Palestinian civilian deaths would be reduced. The Hamas military wing would destroy the Palestinian Authority forces since the PLA doesn't have artillery, tanks, and military aircraft. Most of Hamas fighters have battle experience unlike the PLA Forces.

Bob, I think you get my point now. The majority of the world wouldn't care whether the IDF annihilated Hamas. No one is saying Israel shouldn't defend themselves. It's that they indiscriminately kill Palestine civilians in order to get to the militants which angers us. And as you pointed out yourself, if it where Jewish civilians in the crossfire, they wouldn't be so gun-ho about blasting everything, in other words they don't consider a Palestine life equal to that of a Jewish one. But like spacearrow said, the IDF would rather sacrifice a couple thousand Palestinians rather than endanger a IDF solider. It's safe to say that Anti-Israeli sentiment wouldn't be as significant if there were no civilian casualties.

I'd say give them the West bank. No Jewish settlements, no blockades, embargo, etc. Take away their reason to fight. Palestinians voted Hamas in because they don't see any way out, so giving them freedom from this oppression is really the only way to stop this cycle. Yes, there is a chance that Hamas will re-arm, but if Palestinians get their independence, they'll have no need to support a militant Hamas. Worst case the IDF can always step in again.

That said, while I totally disagree with your viewpoint, I respect that you and those in this thread are keeping this a civil discussion. Look at the other boards on the topic and it's just a clusterfuck of hatred and ignorance. Who would have thought that the most coherent debates would be on freeones?

I think the biggest injustice though is that as soon as another US story hits the headlines (the shooting), the media tosses this issue aside like it never existed. Hopefully the lack of news means that things really have cooled down, at least for now.

 

[bobjustbob]

The militants are the government. Hamas is set in policy to destroy Israel. The tipping point in the negotiations is for Hamas to disarm. Hamas wants to stay armed for what reason? To destroy Israel. This is no secret. Look at history. Every surrounding country has made offensives. Israel pushes them back and later gives back the original boarders. Not until these countries finally got the message to stop the attacks was there some peace. Are you really to believe that an armed Hamas with open boarders would be safe for Israel? I don't hear anything from Hamas remotely suggesting that.

As far as the civilian population goes, both governments have as their first obligation to protect their own citizens. If Hamas is putting it's own citizens at risk then the blood is on their hands, not Israel. Don't store or launch your rockets from schools. I'm certain that the people of Gaza want to live in peace to raise there families in a safe place. That is not what they elected for their government. Hamas wants to wipe out Israel as a primary objective. They did not have to elect Hamas nor are these citizens doing anything about throwing them out.

 

[tvstrip]

Israeli wedding of Jew, Muslim draws protesters amid war tensions

http://news.yahoo.com/israeli-wedding-jew-muslim-draws-protesters-amid-war-000304290.html
Goes to show that religious intolerance occurs on both sides. Sad that an event which gives hope of harmony between the religions was marred by the haters.

You can't simply say Hamas is the government. What about Fatah/ the PLO? It all depends on who and where you ask. Either case, you can't argue that the Israeli restrictions are creating the horrible conditions for Palestinians, which drives many of them to support Hamas. If you give the Palestinians true freedom, i.e. the 1967 borders, no embargoes, no encroaching settlements, they will have no reason to support the extremists.

IMHO as for disarmament, I don't think anybody in the middle east would feel comfortable laying down every weapon they have. Plus it's a sovereign right of every country (including Palestine) to defend itself. If Israel wouldn't agree to disarm, they shouldn't be forcing others to do so.

I'm not proposing a solution to peace in the middle east. Again, the central argument here is that if Palestinian civilians are killed by Israeli weapons, their blood is on the IDF, not Hamas.

 

[Ace Boobtoucher]

I would boycott Palestinian goods but then it occurred to me that I am never going to be in the market for suicide vests, human baby shields, or books filled with antisemitism & historic lies about the land of Israel.

 

[horn_dog]

Israel was right to wipe out Hamas tunnels. And let's not forget:
Guess who contributes more to the world. Arabs or Jews?

TOTAL: 129!

I like your logic, dude. Let's get rid off all the people who have not "contributed to the world". Starting with you.

 

[horn_dog]

Pretty good argument imo

 

[horn_dog]

This video is more current

Finkman, son of holocaust survivors, presents an interesting end game scenario in the end. Let's see what happens...

 

[horn_dog]

'cause many civilians are complicits of the the terrorists since they are their brothers, sons, cousins, friends neighbors, etc. They are complicits by helping them, offering them shelter, food, hiding them and even taking their place when they get killed.

Let's see who you're friends with, or a neighbor or who are your relatives. What a sick mind.

 

[horn_dog]

It would really be great if all you guys would listen to what Norman Finkelstein has to say on those videos, especially the RT one filmed three weeks ago.

But, instead of spending some time hearing a well composed argument against your view, your minds and ears are closed just like the guy asking the question on this video.

I'd love to be wrong.

 

[Ace Boobtoucher]

Anytime someone starts an argument with "It's like the holocaust" or "It's like Apartheid," I immediately ignore them because they have no clue about what they're spewing.

Israel would need to start wholesale slaughter of Palestinians at the rate of about 1000/day in order to over correct the birth/death rate in "Palestine." That, and the fact that Israeli doctors help injured, wounded, sick or pregnant "Palestinians" without a second thought. "Palestinian" doctors on the other hand, pick and choose who they treat by determining their religion.

In no other middle eastern country would an islamic regime allow a Jew, Christian, Druze, Ba' Hai, Buddhist or anyone from any other different faith hold office in their government. Israel does. Israeli Jews, Israeli Arabs, Israeli Christians all live together in relative peace without restrictions on finance, employment or marriage. Oh, and you don't have to renounce your faith to live in Israel as you would in nearly all islamic states. So much for apartheid.

One other thing of note for anyone who supports hamas; Israel uses its military to protect its people. "Palestine" uses its people to protect its military.


temporary image hosting

 

[sean miguel]

^ That right there.

It's just astounding to me to see Israeli doctors treating wounded hamas combatants. That's more than I could do. I'd leave them to die. You're going to have to kill them later anyways.
And imagine the reverse. Yeah, I thought so.

Also, Hamas' charter not only calls for the elimination of Israel, but of jewry worldwide. So, if the jews all migrated to Madagascar like was proposed by the nazis before they just said 'nevermind, let's just gas them', there'd still be a conflict.

 

[Ace Boobtoucher]

image hosting over 10mb

 

[assari]

 

[Little Red Wagon Repairman]

Why don't we just keep our money here in America and tell the Israelis to have at it on their own? I wouldn't resent them as much if I didn't feel we were getting ripped off by them. I wouldn't give them or the Palestinians a fucking dime.

 

[Supafly]

^ That right there.

It's just astounding to me to see Israeli doctors treating wounded hamas combatants. That's more than I could do. I'd leave them to die. You're going to have to kill them later anyways.
And imagine the reverse. Yeah, I thought so.

Also, Hamas' charter not only calls for the elimination of Israel, but of jewry worldwide. So, if the jews all migrated to Madagascar like was proposed by the nazis before they just said 'nevermind, let's just gas them', there'd still be a conflict.

For some time, the english part of their official website is "Under Construction". I think they have problems making their cause sound legitimate and understandable for people of the west

http://www.hamasinfo.net/en/

 

[Rey C.]

Why don't we just keep our money here in America and tell the Israelis to have at it on their own? I wouldn't resent them as much if I didn't feel we were getting ripped off by them. I wouldn't give them or the Palestinians a fucking dime.

Again, the Cranston Amendment makes that impossible. By federal law, we have to give them our money. If we don't have it, then we need to get off our asses and ask the Chinese to lend it to us... so we can give it to our little Israeli pals. It's the law! Simple as that. Several libertarian groups have attempted to repeal this traitorous piece of legislation over the years, but to no avail. The heads of both the DNC and the GOP answer to a higher power... located in Tel Aviv. And the Big Boss Man says they better not even let that be discussed on the House Floor. And like good servants, they obey their master.

Offering (worthless) vouchers to retired American citizens in lieu of actual Medicare insurance is perfectly fine with these traitors. But every foreign aid appropriation since 1983 has included provisions which allow Israel to tap into the pockets of every American taxpayer and take the money without obligation to repay it (with their own money, that is... ). But hell, I have to admire these little guilt-trippers for being able to pull off this scheme for so long... right under the noses of struggling middle-class Americans. Even during the Great Recession, when so many of our own people were suffering, we continued to write checks to these beggars. Can you believe that?! I can. And no, not much surprises me anymore.

AIPAC (American Israel Public Affairs Committee) puts the NRA, the tobacco lobby and every other lobby in America to shame. The big difference is, you can talk about the gun or the tobacco lobby. But you damn well better not even admit that AIPAC exists in public forums or the media. Not if you intend on having any sort of career, that is.

Read Animal Farm and 1984. It will all become clear then.

 

[georges]

SOME DEMS ARE ‘GREATLY CONCERNED BY’ NETANYAHU’S WEST BANK PROMISE
https://www.dailycaller.com/2019/04/12/democrats-netanyahu-israel-west-bank/

 

[georges]

Netanyahu Demolishes Ilhan Omar After She Accuses Israel of ‘Muslim Ban’
https://www.westernjournal.com/ct/i...ff_campaign=pushtraffic&ff_content=2019-08-17