SCOTUS Upholds Obamacare

Jagger69

Three lullabies in an ancient tongue
:clap:

http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/25/politics/supreme-court-ruling-obamacare/

Washington (CNN)Obamacare has survived -- again.

In a major win for the Obama administration, the Supreme Court held in a 6-3 decision that the Affordable Care Act authorized federal tax credits for eligible Americans living not only in states with their own exchanges but also in the 34 states with federal exchanges.

Chief Justice John Roberts wrote for himself, Justice Anthony Kennedy and the four liberal justices. Justice Antonin Scalia wrote the dissent, joined by Clarence Thomas and Samuel Alito.

"Congress passed the Affordable Care Act to improve health insurance markets, not to destroy them," Roberts wrote in the majority opinion. "If at all possible, we must interpret the Act in a way that is consistent with the former, and avoids the latter."

In a dissent, Scalia said "we should start calling this law SCOTUScare," referring to the two times the Court has saved the law.

The ruling staved off a major political showdown and what would have been a mad scramble in some states to set up their own health care exchanges to keep millions from losing healthcare coverage.

Challengers to the law argued that the federal government should not be allowed to continue doling out subsidies to individuals living in states without their own health care exchanges and a ruling in their favor would have cut off subsidies to 6.4 million Americans, absent a congressional fix or state action.

The ruling is a huge victory for President Barack Obama who nearly saw four words in the Affordable Care Act throw his signature achievement into chaos.

The income-based subsidies are crucial to the law's success, helping to make health insurance more affordable and ultimately reducing the number of uninsured Americans, and shutting off the subsidy spigot to individuals in the 34 states that rely on exchanges run by the federal government would have upended the law.

Congress would have had to amend the Affordable Care Act to fix the "established by the state" language -- a politically treacherous and likely untenable action in a Republican Congress -- or governors in the 34 states without their own exchanges, most of them Republicans, would have had to establish their own exchanges -- another tough ask.

Roberts, writing for the majority, said while the contentious phrase was ambiguous, its meaning in context of the law as a whole was clear.

"The context and structure of the Act compel us to depart from what would otherwise be the most natural reading of the pertinent statutory phrase," Roberts wrote.

Roberts, a conservative, was once again an unlikely hero in saving Obama's signature legislative achievement. He took heat from conservatives in 2012 when he first saved the law from a major constitutional challenge in a decision that stunned pundits and politicos across the ideological spectrum.

Republican presidential candidates quickly denounced the ruling.

"I disagree with the Court's ruling and believe they have once again erred in trying to correct the mistakes made by President Obama and Congress in forcing Obamacare on the American people," said Florida Sen. Marco Rubio. "I remain committed to repealing this bad law and replacing it with my consumer-centered plan that puts patients and families back in control of their health care decisions."

Democratic presidential frontrunner Hillary Clinton took to Twitter to praise the decision.

"Yes!" she tweeted. "SCOTUS affirms what we know is true in our hearts & under the law: Health insurance should be affordable & available to all."

Just 16 states and the District of Columbia have set up their own health insurance marketplaces, which left millions of residents in the 34 states that rely on exchanges run by the federal government vulnerable to the Supreme Court's ruling.

Challengers had argued that the words "established by the State" clearly barred the government from doling out subsidies in the 34 states without their own healthcare marketplaces.

They said that Congress limited the subsidies in order to encourage the states to set up their own exchanges and when that failed on a large scale, the IRS tried to "fix" the law.

"If the rule of law means anything, it is that text is not infinitely malleable, and that agencies must follow the law as written—not revise it to 'better achieve' what they assume to have been Congress's purposes," wrote Michael Carvin, an attorney for the challengers.

But it was Solicitor Generald Donald B. Verrilli, Jr. who won over the justices, arguing that Congress always intended the subsidies be available to everyone -- regardless of the actions of their state leaders.

Verrilli warned in court briefs that if the challengers prevailed, the states with federally-run exchanges "would face the very death spirals the Act was structured to avoid and insurance coverage for millions of their residents would be extinguished."

Lower courts had split on the issue. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia invalidated the IRS rule while the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled in favor of the Obama administration.
 

Supafly

Retired Mod
Bronze Member
It was high time that the cititzens of the USA get what is a matter of course in every coutry that is to be considered "first world". And of course, as a country self-declared "christian", it is strange that there can be even a discussion about this.
 

Supafly

Retired Mod
Bronze Member
The Fly adds: You retarded biblethumping, guntoting and warmongering cromagnons, about damn time you get yo ass dragged into the 20th century.

That's right, 20th, you are a loooong way from the 21st.

The day you stop thinking with your guns will be the day

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:
 
The best outcome possible for those that oppose this. Republicans do not have to patch the Titanic and this remains an issue during the 2016 campaign. Employer mandate kicks in and premiums have risen as much as 150 percent. Bad law being handed out piece meal does nothing to expose it . Now it is out there and no more concealing what it is

Democrats own this and it will be in full effect at the peak of election season. Dance in the end zone today but we have a few highly touted draft picks coming in next season. It will be a blast to watch pants suit having to squirm once the country realizes that their premiums have doubled at a minimum and those deductibles that were promised to be lowered by 2500 have in all actuality increased by 2500.

Roberts obviously believes that we get the legislation that we deserve and has decided that the onus is upon us to change the law through our elected officials . We are witnessing a bi-annual constitutional convention via SCOTUS decisions.


You must either be independently wealthy, have the health of a 16 year old or firmly ensconced in Medicare or Medicaid to support what is apparent to some of us now, but will soon be to the vast majority of Americans one of the worst laws to ever be forced upon this country.

Wealth redistribution at its finest
 
The Fly adds: You retarded biblethumping, guntoting and warmongering cromagnons, about damn time you get yo ass dragged into the 20th century.

That's right, 20th, you are a loooong way from the 21st.

The day you stop thinking with your guns will be the day

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:


Careful now, I wouldn't want anyone to think that post had any intent to bait or flame.

Now that you have expressed your feelings, care to dissect the law for us and not just some of the cluless drive by postings that make you so endearing to most of us here?
 

Jagger69

Three lullabies in an ancient tongue
Blue is right, Fly. Baiting and flaming are definitely frowned upon and for good reason.

By the way, I applaud this specifically because it was the correct judicial decision from my perspective so there's no "dancing in the end zone" going on with me. Personally, I think the ACA is deeply flawed as written (and now interpreted) but not for the same reasons that most conservatives would.
 

Rey C.

Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
You must either be independently wealthy, have the health of a 16 year old or firmly ensconced in Medicare or Medicaid to support what is apparent to some of us now, but will soon be to the vast majority of Americans one of the worst laws to ever be forced upon this country.

Wealth redistribution at its finest

Medicaid, but not Medicare. I haven't kept up with the latest developments, but the plan was to cut Medicare (which working people pay into) and use that money to expand Medicaid, which is more of a pure entitlement. Continued, unchecked Medicaid expansion is going to become a ticking time bomb in the near future, I predict. Combine that with the increasing number of people finding inventive ways to get on disability (and stay on it longer), and you've got a real entitlement mess.

As you probably recall, I was in favor of health care reform. But what we ended up getting was insurance reform, not so much (actual) health care reform. If you had bought a basket of health related insurance stocks five years ago, you'd have made a tidy sum. And with today's ruling, you'd have another nice surge in those stocks. I'm just following the money. Hospital companies have also done very well (vs. the S&P 500) over the past few years. The promise that hospitals would use technological advancements to become more efficient and be able to pass cost savings on to patients has not come to pass. My doctor is part of a rather large hospital system. When I see any specialist within that system, it's like I'm a new born baby every time I see a new doctor there. Patient billing and records are not linked from doctor to doctor within that hospital system. I know that's anecdotal, but I don't think it's an anomaly.

I stand by my belief that the United States badly needed health care reform. But the ACA is (IMO) one of the most flawed laws we have ever had in this nation. I blame the Democrats for forming this monster. And I blame the Republicans for sitting on their hands and making outlandish claims, instead of coming up with a rational, practical alternative.
 

Supafly

Retired Mod
Bronze Member
Careful now, I wouldn't want anyone to think that post had any intent to bait or flame.

Now that you have expressed your feelings, care to dissect the law for us and not just some of the cluless drive by postings that make you so endearing to most of us here?

Welcome back.

No, no further words for now.
 

Jagger69

Three lullabies in an ancient tongue
Medicaid, but not Medicare. I haven't kept up with the latest developments, but the plan was to cut Medicare (which working people pay into) and use that money to expand Medicaid, which is more of a pure entitlement. Continued, unchecked Medicaid expansion is going to become a ticking time bomb in the near future, I predict. Combine that with the increasing number of people finding inventive ways to get on disability (and stay on it longer), and you've got a real entitlement mess.

As you probably recall, I was in favor of health care reform. But what we ended up getting was insurance reform, not so much (actual) health care reform. If you had bought a basket of health related insurance stocks five years ago, you'd have made a tidy sum. And with today's ruling, you'd have another nice surge in those stocks. I'm just following the money. Hospital companies have also done very well (vs. the S&P 500) over the past few years. The promise that hospitals would use technological advancements to become more efficient and be able to pass cost savings on to patients has not come to pass. My doctor is part of a rather large hospital system. When I see any specialist within that system, it's like I'm a new born baby every time I see a new doctor there. Patient billing and records are not linked from doctor to doctor within that hospital system. I know that's anecdotal, but I don't think it's an anomaly.

I stand by my belief that the United States badly needed health care reform. But the ACA is (IMO) one of the most flawed laws we have ever had in this nation. I blame the Democrats for forming this monster. And I blame the Republicans for sitting on their hands and making outlandish claims, instead of coming up with a rational, practical alternative.

:goodpost:

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Rey C. again.
 
IMO SCOTUS saved the GOP from themselves with this ruling. The GOP has no appetite to pass a healthcare law of their own. If the ruling went the other way that would have meant 6 million people would've lost their insurance and the GOP would've had to scramble to cobble together enough support to get their own law through and it would've been a mess. They would much rather keep the status quo and just keep railing against the law as they've been doing for the last 5 years
 

Ace Boobtoucher

Founder and Captain of the Douchepatrol
Shitty decisions and judicial legislation like this are why term limits are needed for every federal judge. Congress, too.
 

Jagger69

Three lullabies in an ancient tongue
IMO SCOTUS saved the GOP from themselves with this ruling. The GOP has no appetite to pass a healthcare law of their own. If the ruling went the other way that would have meant 6 million people would've lost their insurance and the GOP would've had to scramble to cobble together enough support to get their own law through and it would've been a mess. They would much rather keep the status quo and just keep railing against the law as they've been doing for the last 5 years

Agree completely. May end up to be somewhat of a Pyrrhic victory for those who support the ACA.

Shitty decisions and judicial legislation like this are why term limits are needed for every federal judge. Congress, too.

I agree with your term limit comment Johnny but this decision was exactly the proper one from a judicial viewpoint and the exact opposite of judicial legislation. If you want to get rid of the ACA, it needs to be done via the way it was created....through the legislative branch.
 
Agree completely. May end up to be somewhat of a Pyrrhic victory for those who support the ACA.



I agree with your term limit comment Johnny but this decision was exactly the proper one from a judicial viewpoint and the exact opposite of judicial legislation. If you want to get rid of the ACA, it needs to be done via the way it was created....through the legislative branch.

That is fine and dandy, but I do not like hearing Obama try and paint this as something that ever had bi-partisan support as he tried to do today. It is getting to the point that he just says things and people believe it is true.

As for Roberts, my impression of him is not the same as some of my conservative friends. I believe that he does not like tampering with legislation. I don't believe there is a sinister plot by Roberts to uphold Obamacare. He is in a sense remanding this back to the American people and saying if you want this thing changed, do it yourself through the people you elect and don't look to us to fix the screw ups of the people you put in office.
 
History will show that ultimately this decision will be the right one. Had the subsidies been thrown out congress would have had to address those that lost their subsidies and would have been forced to quickly implement an alternative. The sour grapes by Democrats would have been on such a level that I am not sure Obama would have even signed it. I think in the grand scheme of things that if Americans are against the ACA as people claim, that this increases the chance of a Republican winning the White House more than they were just 24 hours ago.
 
This was the last major threat to the ACA, there are no major threats on the horizon now for the ACA. The next opportunity for repeal will come in 2017 if there's a Republican in the White House. But even the critics of the ACA have to admit that it's going to be awfully tough to take away insurance from the 36 million people who will be covered by 2017 (According to the CBO)
 

Ace Boobtoucher

Founder and Captain of the Douchepatrol
It's taken them how long and how much wasted money just to get to seven million people? Worst boondoggle in American history. Global warming/climate change is a distant 2nd.
 
This was the last major threat to the ACA, there are no major threats on the horizon now for the ACA. The next opportunity for repeal will come in 2017 if there's a Republican in the White House. But even the critics of the ACA have to admit that it's going to be awfully tough to take away insurance from the 36 million people who will be covered by 2017 (According to the CBO)

This is an example of the flawed logic of liberals. Not saying it will happen but if Republicans are elected, that would indicate that the electorate approved of dismantling this clusterfuck.
 

xfire

New Twitter/X @cxffreeman
The ACA is the first step towards a single payer system. Republican opposition is slowly eroding and the longer the ACA is law the more likely that other changes will meet less resistance. And really, why so much resistance to the basic right of healthcare is beyond me. Not everything should be a profit center.
 
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