Theopolis Q. Hossenffer
I am in America, not of it.
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Bill and Hillary Clinton: As crooked as a barrel of fishhooks
- Thread starter Jack Davenport
- Start date
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
I agree with your comment with one expansion: the Republican candidates do exactly the same thing. It's the whole 'man in the arena' concept. Days could be spent digging up Trump's tweets about how certain things would not happen under his watch. And guess what - they have. It has nothing to do with party.
ChuckFaze
Closed Account
I see your point, gmase. What I was trying to get across more to the exact point is that right now at THIS very instant in real time, ONLY Trump has to actually deal with the pandemic and actually execute whatever ideas he has to try and hogtie Covid-19. Right or wrong, fast or slow, working or not working, popular or not popular ... Trump right now has to actually take shots at the Covid-19 target. Anyone else can just say that they would have hit the target's bullseye with one shot back in March with the precision of a Sniper and that Covid-19 would have been wiped out by now. They don't actually have to take a shot and prove it.
But yeah, I see what you're saying. Armchair Quarterbacking / Monday Morning Quarterbacking goes on from both sides. 😁
But yeah, I see what you're saying. Armchair Quarterbacking / Monday Morning Quarterbacking goes on from both sides. 😁
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
Exactly. It probably wouldn't be a stretch to say any Democrat would have reacted in a similar manner to Cuomo, Newsom, et al. at the start. We know what happened there. Now, we're seeing a surge in states which are more typically more conservative.
All he had to do was listen to the experts, and follow the guidelines of his own government, and maybe not lie about every fucking thing. Maybe taking a little responsibility instead of standing on 140k+ graves claiming he's done a "phenomenal" job would have helped too.
Yes, the response of anyone else as president would be purely hypothetical, but trump's incompetence, failure, and denial is absolute.
ChuckFaze
Closed Account
BS ... it is not that simple. It'd be great if it was. Even The Experts / scientists are just trying to figure it out as they go along.
If you remember, in the beginning, "The Experts" (including the Surgeon General) basically ridiculed us for daring to wear masks. They for all practical purposes said it was stupid to wear masks if we were NOT sick as it wouldn't help anything and we'd just be depleting the supply of masks. Supposedly only wearing masks when you were already sick helped anything. I never bought that logic.
And NOW those same Experts say wearing masks is the biggest key to getting Covid-19 under control.
In trying to make Trump look bad, the experts and the media frothed at the mouth and bent over backwards to put down the effectiveness of Hydroxychloroquine. Instead, they started promoting the NEW REAL savior Remdesivir. Since Covid-19 cases have spiked everywhere in the WORLD, apparently the Experts' Silver Bullet suggestion Remdesivir has done squat.
Again, this pandemic is a moving equation with various factors of which probably the biggest factor is the stupid, foolish, careless, dumbass PEOPLE who won't listen and do their part.
As an analogy: In computer security, there is a concept --- The weakest link in any computer's security is the operator. It doesn't matter what high octane security suite you have, if you're a careless, foolish dumbass, your computer is going to get infected.
Likewise, it is being proven that no matter what plan there is in place ... with all the stupid, foolish, careless, selfish dumbass people out there not cooperating and doing their part, it is going to be very difficult to get Covid-19 under control without a vaccine. And you cannot just wave a magic wand and say "Abracadabra" and have a vaccine have materialized back in March. Does Biden have a vaccine? No, I didn't think so. And neither do Hillary, Obama or any other Democrat. So it's horseshit to try to imply that some Democrat as President would have had Covid-19 under control right now with some totally different and revolutionary plan.
Exhibit A: That dumbass Portland Mayor leading his Band of Covid-19 Solution Hindering Criminal Dumbasses .
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
And people like that ARE the biggest problem in this pandemic.
Great to see that idiot mayor get his Sticking His Nose Where It Doesn't Belong Face tear gassed. That ought to teach him to start getting with the program and follow the list of Do's & Don'ts.
If you remember, in the beginning, "The Experts" (including the Surgeon General) basically ridiculed us for daring to wear masks. They for all practical purposes said it was stupid to wear masks if we were NOT sick as it wouldn't help anything and we'd just be depleting the supply of masks. Supposedly only wearing masks when you were already sick helped anything. I never bought that logic.
And NOW those same Experts say wearing masks is the biggest key to getting Covid-19 under control.
In trying to make Trump look bad, the experts and the media frothed at the mouth and bent over backwards to put down the effectiveness of Hydroxychloroquine. Instead, they started promoting the NEW REAL savior Remdesivir. Since Covid-19 cases have spiked everywhere in the WORLD, apparently the Experts' Silver Bullet suggestion Remdesivir has done squat.
Again, this pandemic is a moving equation with various factors of which probably the biggest factor is the stupid, foolish, careless, dumbass PEOPLE who won't listen and do their part.
As an analogy: In computer security, there is a concept --- The weakest link in any computer's security is the operator. It doesn't matter what high octane security suite you have, if you're a careless, foolish dumbass, your computer is going to get infected.
Likewise, it is being proven that no matter what plan there is in place ... with all the stupid, foolish, careless, selfish dumbass people out there not cooperating and doing their part, it is going to be very difficult to get Covid-19 under control without a vaccine. And you cannot just wave a magic wand and say "Abracadabra" and have a vaccine have materialized back in March. Does Biden have a vaccine? No, I didn't think so. And neither do Hillary, Obama or any other Democrat. So it's horseshit to try to imply that some Democrat as President would have had Covid-19 under control right now with some totally different and revolutionary plan.
Exhibit A: That dumbass Portland Mayor leading his Band of Covid-19 Solution Hindering Criminal Dumbasses .
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
And people like that ARE the biggest problem in this pandemic.
Great to see that idiot mayor get his Sticking His Nose Where It Doesn't Belong Face tear gassed. That ought to teach him to start getting with the program and follow the list of Do's & Don'ts.
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Trying to figure it out as they go along is commonly known as the scientific method. The experts give the best advice they can with the information available to them at the time. This advice changes as new information becomes available. This is a brand new disease that nobody had studied a year ago.
trump makes up some bullshit in his severely addled brain and sticks to it no matter what.
In the early days, yes, it was advised that masks were not necessary and they should be reserved for front line workers. In those days, outbreaks were localised, and containment was still a possibility. Many experts probably assumed that the government would follow their own guidelines on slowing the spread of a communicable disease outbreak. Their faith was tragically misplaced.
I'm no doctor, but I understand that the advice you give when there are small, localised outbreaks of a communicable disease would be different from the advice you give when that same disease is raging out of control across the entire country.
The advice on testing and contact tracing has never changed. From day 1 testing, tracing, and isolation has been advised as the best way to slow the spread of the disease, and in case you failed to notice, the majority of countries around the world have done that with great effect. I've never worn a mask, and aside from a few areas that have seen spikes here in Australia and some state border restrictions, daily life has been pretty normal for some time.
This attitude of dismissing the experts because their advice changes is a shocking level of ignorance, and is one of the greatest dangers facing us as a species, not just where covid is concerned.
Your claim that there's no way of knowing if a different government was in charge completely falls apart if you consider just about every other developed nation in the world. They tested, they traced, they isolated, and they were able to return to a pretty normal life relatively quickly. The situation is the USA is still getting worse. Doctors and health experts are calling for a national testing and tracing strategy, and being ignored. And the trump admin has basically just given up and walked away.
It's the standard play for trump, an issue comes up, he claims to have solved it easily and quickly despite having done nothing, and then moves on, and most people tend to forget about it. But covid is kind of hard to forget when over a thousand Americans a day are dying, while the president sits on tv and talks about what a phenomenal job he's done.
trump makes up some bullshit in his severely addled brain and sticks to it no matter what.
In the early days, yes, it was advised that masks were not necessary and they should be reserved for front line workers. In those days, outbreaks were localised, and containment was still a possibility. Many experts probably assumed that the government would follow their own guidelines on slowing the spread of a communicable disease outbreak. Their faith was tragically misplaced.
I'm no doctor, but I understand that the advice you give when there are small, localised outbreaks of a communicable disease would be different from the advice you give when that same disease is raging out of control across the entire country.
The advice on testing and contact tracing has never changed. From day 1 testing, tracing, and isolation has been advised as the best way to slow the spread of the disease, and in case you failed to notice, the majority of countries around the world have done that with great effect. I've never worn a mask, and aside from a few areas that have seen spikes here in Australia and some state border restrictions, daily life has been pretty normal for some time.
This attitude of dismissing the experts because their advice changes is a shocking level of ignorance, and is one of the greatest dangers facing us as a species, not just where covid is concerned.
Your claim that there's no way of knowing if a different government was in charge completely falls apart if you consider just about every other developed nation in the world. They tested, they traced, they isolated, and they were able to return to a pretty normal life relatively quickly. The situation is the USA is still getting worse. Doctors and health experts are calling for a national testing and tracing strategy, and being ignored. And the trump admin has basically just given up and walked away.
It's the standard play for trump, an issue comes up, he claims to have solved it easily and quickly despite having done nothing, and then moves on, and most people tend to forget about it. But covid is kind of hard to forget when over a thousand Americans a day are dying, while the president sits on tv and talks about what a phenomenal job he's done.
ChuckFaze
Closed Account
Exactly ... as in NO ONE has THE definitive answer.
Comparing the situations of the USA and Australia is Apples to Oranges.
The populations are drastically different. From what I am seeing, Texas alone has more people than Australia. That changes the equation drastically. And while I've never been to Australia, I've no doubt the people and their behavior is different.
As I've mentioned on various comments on the forum, regardless of how people are in OTHER countries, it has become very apparent that HERE in the middle of the pandemic, way too many people just flat out do not like to be told what to do and refuse to follow rules that are for their own health and for getting Covid under control.
An example: The 4th of July holiday just passed. There were Fireworks Ordinances banning fireworks on the 4th. And Guidelines designed to prevent people from gathering. By the sights and sounds, it was obvious the majority of the people completely ignored the ordinances and guidelines. Disobedience like that by the people here goes on everyday.
With you in Australia, you cannot possibly know the reality of what it's like here.
Oh well. I know you won't agree with anything I said. Enjoy your non-mask wearing over there if that's what works there.
Here with way more people and with foolish, rebellious, bitching, disobedient, riot-happy behavior ... I like to think that I have stayed Covid free by wearing a mask and following all the other recommended safety rules.
Theopolis Q. Hossenffer
I am in America, not of it.
Chuck I absolutely agree with you on your remarks on Human nature. As I responded to another post you made many folks especially here in America seem to have the motto of "you are not the Boss of me" embossed in their brains. I think the issue here is the fact that even though many thought at the start that this disease was going to be another Sars type event to be fairly easily controlled. But after it became obvious it was not the problem became that no one in charge was willing to make a plan to try to fight it. Could Hillary done better? Probably. But find a cure or completely control it, most likely not. This whole good luck America, hope it works out system is just as if Eisenhower said to his Generals: OK guys the Germans are over there. Go get them and let me know how it comes out. Leaders can try and fail but Trump and his folks have failed to try.
FOUser#4510856320198a
BANNED
@ChuckFaze - I really have to commend your patience, use of facts, logic, and sound reasoning in your effort to reach the soft-brains. Nonetheless, I think that you're wasting your time - it's absolutely obvious to everyone that Trump gave George Floyd covid, and then suffocated him because he wasn't dying fast enough. And then he had a rally about it, and told everyone to bring masks to burn. I can't believe you support Trump. You're part of the problem, but Joe Biden's gonna fix your wagon!
gmase
Nattering Nabob of Negativism
As always, thanks Dick.
ChuckFaze
Closed Account
Yeah, it HAS turned out to be a major
waste of time.Especially when Democrats are working 24/7 and expending every ounce of their energy to try to ensure that getting Covid-19 under control does NOT succeed. It's their new latest last resort to try and beat Trump since they cannot beat him at the voting booths.
Theopolis Q. Hossenffer
I am in America, not of it.
I have warned you about thinking.
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ChuckFaze
Closed Account
Says the squealing, shamelessly pandering Fraud Bitch Swine after not being able to go silently into the night ... not being able to let it go coming up on 4 YEARS after having LOST!
It's fucking embarrassing ... her pathetically, shamelessly pandering for a job ... ANY job. As long as it has a smidgen of a connection to the Presidency. I guess she'll feel like she fulfilled her dream even if she only gets to be the Official Paper Shreader and E-mail Deleter.
I can just hear her, "Joe! Joe! Pick me! Choose me! Give me a job. I'll let you sniff me all day everyday. I'll let you feel me. Just let me rub elbows with the Presidency." Pathetic.
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