What has Happened to the Republican Party?

[abrogate]

As there is significant proof of (very slow) financial rebound, and as there is significant proof that the jobless rate is (very slowly) going down, and as there is significant proof that Obama's long-term policies seem to actually be good for the nation (bringing the troops home, for example), I'm going to have to go ahead and say that everything you said in this post is complete bullshit.

No issues with the post, but politicians making claims aside, there is some thought that the economy would be recover anyway regardless of Obama's policies. I've heard the Republican argument that his policies are slowing down the recover, but I read that as more political nonsense. The thought was there during the recovery the recovery in the 80's under Reagan, that it would have occurred with or without his policies. We are recovering, but I'm a bit less certain about the causes than Obama was in his State of the Union stump.

He should take a bow for bringing home the troops. That is great to see.

 

[lurkingdirk]

No issues with the post, but politicians making claims aside, there is some thought that the economy would be recover anyway regardless of Obama's policies. I've heard the Republican argument that his policies are slowing down the recover, but I read that as more political nonsense. The thought was there during the recovery the recovery in the 80's under Reagan, that it would have occurred with or without his policies. We are recovering, but I'm a bit less certain about the causes than Obama was in his State of the Union stump.

He should take a bow for bringing home the troops. That is great to see.

The concept of a self correcting economy is an old concept. And a deeply flawed one. However, I hear what you're saying.

 

[abrogate]

The concept of a self correcting economy is an old concept. And a deeply flawed one. However, I hear what you're saying.

I'm not really making that claim. Just trying to take a step back and figure it out. The Republican field really just seems to be filled with with disinformation and Obama isn't helping me by seeming to take credit for every good thing that happens and push out the bad stuff. Nothing new in the world of politics. Just trying to separate the wheat from the chafe.

 

[xfire]

Obama isn't helping me by seeming to take credit for every good thing that happens and push out the bad stuff.

What bad stuff should he take credit for?

 

[abrogate]

What bad stuff should he take credit for?

Not sure why you would pick that one item out of thought I had in the message, other than to bait.

There are have a few items that have been posted on this thread that the posters would believe answer your question.

On this thread the investment in Solyndra, extension of the Tax Reconciliation Act, and a prioritization and handling of the HealthCare Reform bill that contributed to the current climate on not cooperating in Washington D.C.

 

[xfire]

With the exception of Solyndra, which I believe is nothing more than hot air being pumped out of Fox News, I would like a reasoned explanation of how the tax cut extension and health care reform are 1) "bad things" & 2) why Obama should take credit for them.

Not sure why you would pick that one item out of thought I had in the message, other than to bait.

If you don't want to have to defend what you say then you should be more careful in how you word things. That "one item" is what I took most issue with in what you posted.

 

[xfire]

What has Happened to the Republican Party?

The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president. -Mitch McConnell

More important than anything else, they want to make Obama a one-term president. That means take every opportunity to attack, obstruct, lie, and smear. They've done a great job hardening their base. Fortunately their base is a small teabagging minority.

 

[Supafly]

The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president. -Mitch McConnell

More important than anything else, they want to make Obama a one-term president. That means take every opportunity to attack, obstruct, lie, and smear. They've done a great job hardening their base. Fortunately their base is a small teabagging minority.

GOP Promises To Filibuster Everything

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNAeENlnwZ8

I rest my case.

 

[xfire]

Excellent link, Supa. TYT is one of my favorite information outlets.

Oh, and while we're talking about Solyndra, abrogate, let's talk about a real scandal, one involving John Boehner.

John Boehner's Keystone XL conflict of interest

Environmentalists note that in December 2010, according to Boehner’s financial disclosure forms, he invested $10,000 to $50,000 each in seven firms that had a stake in Canada’s oil sands, the region that produces the oil the pipeline would transport. The firms include six oil companies—BP, Canadian Natural Resources, Chevron, Conoco Phillips, Devon Energy and Exxon—along with Emerson Electric, which has a contract to provide the digital automation for the first phase of a $9.4 billion Horizon Oil Sands Project in Canada.

 

[Rey C.]

I'm not putting a blanket over the entire GOP. But one thing I have observed over the last few years (see if you agree): if you find a person who is angry, paranoid and fairly ignorant of basic, accepted facts... there's a better than average chance that he/she will be a Republican. Now, I hate stereotypes as much as the next person. So again, I'm not saying that ALL Republicans are that way. But I am saying that (just based on observation) if a person displays those three character traits, if they are a member of a political party, it will likely be the GOP. Look at the people on FreeOnes who are the most partisan. Ever notice how angry they are, how paranoid they seem to be ("the gubment is out to git me!") and how (I'm trying to be nice here) lacking in "basic comprehensive skills" they often are??? :dunno:

There was a time in the not so distant past that you had Eisenhower Republicans (moderates who had a vision for the nation) and then Rockefeller Establishment Republicans, who took on the Goldwater Conservative Republicans in the 60's. But what we have now are the Radical Republicans vs. the Radical Extremist Republicans. Every time I watch one of their debates, it amuses me to watch these people race each other to the right. When all you have to choose from is the neo-con camp or the Evangelical wingnut camp, life ain't good for those who'd like a (sane) alternative to Obama or the Democrat party. It's just too bad that anyone who can read & write, believes that the Earth is round and not flat and who believes that "deregulatin' and cuttin' taxes" is NOT the only solution to every economic problem in the world, has been shown the door by the ham-fisted, low brow, slobbering mob that now constitutes the "moral majority" of the Republican party. We have a couple of members who say that they'd be happy with anyone besides Obama (even a dead dog, according to one). But I think we all realize that these are the kinds of partisan wingnuts, who if their daughter was raped, the first question they'd ask is if the rapist was a Democrat or a Republican. As long as it wasn't a Democrat, they'd learn to live with the attack. By the same token, when it was W. Bush and his policies taking this nation off the rails, that bothered them less than the (better) economic conditions of today. Apparently we're in a depression right now (according to a FreeOnes wingnut). Hell, I thought I did a pretty OK job of keeping up with economic data. I guess I somehow missed that news alert.

I'm pretty dumb. But I refuse to vote for someone who is even dumber than I am. I'm not really all that honest. And I refuse to vote for someone who is an even bigger crook than me. So right there I've eliminated pretty much the entire Republican field this primary season.

 

[Jagger69]

I'm not putting a blanket over the entire GOP. But one thing I have observed over the last few years (see if you agree): if you find a person who is angry, paranoid and fairly ignorant of basic, accepted facts... there's a better than average chance that he/she will be a Republican. Now, I hate stereotypes as much as the next person. So again, I'm not saying that ALL Republicans are that way. But I am saying that (just based on observation) if a person displays those three character traits, if they are a member of a political party, it will likely be the GOP. Look at the people on FreeOnes who are the most partisan. Ever notice how angry they are, how paranoid they seem to be ("the gubment is out to git me!") and how (I'm trying to be nice here) lacking in "basic comprehensive skills" they often are??? :dunno:

There was a time in the not so distant past that you had Eisenhower Republicans (moderates who had a vision for the nation) and then Rockefeller Establishment Republicans, who took on the Goldwater Conservative Republicans in the 60's. But what we have now are the Radical Republicans vs. the Radical Extremist Republicans. Every time I watch one of their debates, it amuses me to watch these people race each other to the right. When all you have to choose from is the neo-con camp or the Evangelical wingnut camp, life ain't good for those who'd like a (sane) alternative to Obama or the Democrat party. It's just too bad that anyone who can read & write, believes that the Earth is round and not flat and who believes that "deregulatin' and cuttin' taxes" is NOT the only solution to every economic problem in the world, has been shown the door by the ham-fisted, low brow, slobbering mob that now constitutes the "moral majority" of the Republican party. We have a couple of members who say that they'd be happy with anyone besides Obama (even a dead dog, according to one). But I think we all realize that these are the kinds of partisan wingnuts, who if their daughter was raped, the first question they'd ask is if the rapist was a Democrat or a Republican. As long as it wasn't a Democrat, they'd learn to live with the attack. By the same token, when it was W. Bush and his policies taking this nation off the rails, that bothered them less than the (better) economic conditions of today. Apparently we're in a depression right now (according to a FreeOnes wingnut). Hell, I thought I did a pretty OK job of keeping up with economic data. I guess I somehow missed that news alert.

I'm pretty dumb. But I refuse to vote for someone who is even dumber than I am. I'm not really all that honest. And I refuse to vote for someone who is an even bigger crook than me. So right there I've eliminated pretty much the entire Republican field this primary season.

:goodpost:

I saw a bumper sticker a couple of weeks ago (in fucking Texas no less!!!) that said "Vote Republican....it's easier than thinking!". Pretty much sums things up. Angry, afraid and uninformed (or misinformed) fits them perfectly. Sheeple and dittoheads.

 

[abrogate]

With the exception of Solyndra, which I believe is nothing more than hot air being pumped out of Fox News, I would like a reasoned explanation of how the tax cut extension and health care reform are 1) "bad things" & 2) why Obama should take credit for them.




If you don't want to have to defend what you say then you should be more careful in how you word things. That "one item" is what I took most issue with in what you posted.

1. The tax cut extension cost about $544b for a short term arguable boost. At a time when debt continues to grow and the economy has slow growth.
2. I never said that Health Care Reform was a bad thing.
3. Solyndra is embarrassing for the Obama administration. It isn't the scandal that the Repulican machine would like it to be (and Jon Stewart jokes about), but it is a mistake. Republicans will spin it as funneling money and Democrats will write it off as a non-issue. It was a goof. The dollars aren't huge, but I would hope there is no impact on green investment.

http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2011/10/04/solyndra-scandal-fallout/
http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-675770

I'm ok with you challenging thoughts and ideas and certainly facts. The issue I take with you is that you cut up a posting and pull out words to actually try to change the meaning of the post. That is dishonest move that only a clown makes. Unless I was joking, I would never do that. The only thing I'll ask of you is to not be that clown.

Since you felt it convenient to continue to attack and not answer the question I asked of you, I'll return the favor unless you actually want to have a conversation as opposed to selling a point of view.

I'm not putting a blanket over the entire GOP. But one thing I have observed over the last few years (see if you agree): if you find a person who is angry, paranoid and fairly ignorant of basic, accepted facts... there's a better than average chance that he/she will be a Republican. Now, I hate stereotypes as much as the next person. So again, I'm not saying that ALL Republicans are that way. But I am saying that (just based on observation) if a person displays those three character traits, if they are a member of a political party, it will likely be the GOP. Look at the people on FreeOnes who are the most partisan. Ever notice how angry they are, how paranoid they seem to be ("the gubment is out to git me!") and how (I'm trying to be nice here) lacking in "basic comprehensive skills" they often are??? :dunno:

There was a time in the not so distant past that you had Eisenhower Republicans (moderates who had a vision for the nation) and then Rockefeller Establishment Republicans, who took on the Goldwater Conservative Republicans in the 60's. But what we have now are the Radical Republicans vs. the Radical Extremist Republicans. Every time I watch one of their debates, it amuses me to watch these people race each other to the right. When all you have to choose from is the neo-con camp or the Evangelical wingnut camp, life ain't good for those who'd like a (sane) alternative to Obama or the Democrat party. It's just too bad that anyone who can read & write, believes that the Earth is round and not flat and who believes that "deregulatin' and cuttin' taxes" is NOT the only solution to every economic problem in the world, has been shown the door by the ham-fisted, low brow, slobbering mob that now constitutes the "moral majority" of the Republican party. We have a couple of members who say that they'd be happy with anyone besides Obama (even a dead dog, according to one). But I think we all realize that these are the kinds of partisan wingnuts, who if their daughter was raped, the first question they'd ask is if the rapist was a Democrat or a Republican. As long as it wasn't a Democrat, they'd learn to live with the attack. By the same token, when it was W. Bush and his policies taking this nation off the rails, that bothered them less than the (better) economic conditions of today. Apparently we're in a depression right now (according to a FreeOnes wingnut). Hell, I thought I did a pretty OK job of keeping up with economic data. I guess I somehow missed that news alert.

I'm pretty dumb. But I refuse to vote for someone who is even dumber than I am. I'm not really all that honest. And I refuse to vote for someone who is an even bigger crook than me. So right there I've eliminated pretty much the entire Republican field this primary season.

That was a darn good posting. I like to have choices and I'll never fully agree with any person running for office, but with the nonsense that the Republican candidates are spewing I don't see a legitimate option or consideration.
It is interesting how the parties evolve over the years.

 

[darkwarrior3007]

I'm not putting a blanket over the entire GOP. But one thing I have observed over the last few years (see if you agree): if you find a person who is angry, paranoid and fairly ignorant of basic, accepted facts... there's a better than average chance that he/she will be a Republican. Now, I hate stereotypes as much as the next person. So again, I'm not saying that ALL Republicans are that way. But I am saying that (just based on observation) if a person displays those three character traits, if they are a member of a political party, it will likely be the GOP. Look at the people on FreeOnes who are the most partisan. Ever notice how angry they are, how paranoid they seem to be ("the gubment is out to git me!") and how (I'm trying to be nice here) lacking in "basic comprehensive skills" they often are??? :dunno:

There was a time in the not so distant past that you had Eisenhower Republicans (moderates who had a vision for the nation) and then Rockefeller Establishment Republicans, who took on the Goldwater Conservative Republicans in the 60's. But what we have now are the Radical Republicans vs. the Radical Extremist Republicans. Every time I watch one of their debates, it amuses me to watch these people race each other to the right. When all you have to choose from is the neo-con camp or the Evangelical wingnut camp, life ain't good for those who'd like a (sane) alternative to Obama or the Democrat party. It's just too bad that anyone who can read & write, believes that the Earth is round and not flat and who believes that "deregulatin' and cuttin' taxes" is NOT the only solution to every economic problem in the world, has been shown the door by the ham-fisted, low brow, slobbering mob that now constitutes the "moral majority" of the Republican party. We have a couple of members who say that they'd be happy with anyone besides Obama (even a dead dog, according to one). But I think we all realize that these are the kinds of partisan wingnuts, who if their daughter was raped, the first question they'd ask is if the rapist was a Democrat or a Republican. As long as it wasn't a Democrat, they'd learn to live with the attack. By the same token, when it was W. Bush and his policies taking this nation off the rails, that bothered them less than the (better) economic conditions of today. Apparently we're in a depression right now (according to a FreeOnes wingnut). Hell, I thought I did a pretty OK job of keeping up with economic data. I guess I somehow missed that news alert.

I'm pretty dumb. But I refuse to vote for someone who is even dumber than I am. I'm not really all that honest. And I refuse to vote for someone who is an even bigger crook than me. So right there I've eliminated pretty much the entire Republican field this primary season.

I can tell you, as an Independent, I sure as hell don't see a competent alternative on the Republican side. I tried but it just seems like they keep giving me a reason NOT to vote their way. I just keep doing this,.

 

[nylo]

The problem with the Republican party is that they have completely lost touch with the people. Traditionally, the Republicans were conservative, for the wealthy and corporations. And the Democrats were for the liberals and the average joe. Problem is now there really isn't much of a difference between them anymore and neither is happy unless you are either far right or far left. Some of the biggest problems I see with them is that they are hypocritical. They love to shove the "moral" issue into the ring all the time. And then you find out they are some of the most degraded hypocrites going. First of all at least in my opinion, morality is not something that should enter the political arena. For example if a guy or girl wants to be a total degenerate in the bedroom who gives a shit? If that makes the person happy and they do a better job because of it, SO BE IT. I just don't like all their moralizing and trying to restrict my personal freedoms for their own agenda. Take abortion...why the fuck does this keep coming up? Right or wrong, what a woman does with her body is HER business and government has no right to say otherwise. Also, lest we forget it was a Republican president that bailed out the banks and those companies. And they did it on the American tax payers back...if it was me the banks and those companies should have been allowed to fail. Poor mismanagment does not mean that the government has to save your companies ass. And although this is not a popular opinion right now, the only way to cut the exploded federal deficit is the increase the taxes on the wealthy. This was a common practice until the Ronster became president and fucked it up. Many see him as a good president, do some research my friends...HE WAS NOT!! He was a puppet for wall street and it was under his watch that the manufacturing and etc started to be moved to China...but that is another soapbox for me.

What needs to happen is some other legitimate parties need to gain some ground and give the Republicans and the Democrats some serious challenges. Because as of now, we only have two choices. And as we know, competition is a good thing as it forces those to excel. If you really look at it, was there really any serious change when Obama took over for Bush??? Not really, same BULLSHIT different face.

In the words of Lewis Black...Whats the difference between a Republican and a Democrat? Republicans blow and Democrats suck!

 

[Straight Shooter]

What did you guys think about Mitch Daniels rebuttal last night? Could he be anymore of a downer. Jesus, listening to him you'd think that Armageddon was coming. Talk about playing on people's fear.

 

[lurkingdirk]

What did you guys think about Mitch Daniels rebuttal last night? Could he be anymore of a downer. Jesus, listening to him you'd think that Armageddon was coming. Talk about playing on people's fear.

I'm so glad he's not running. He's had a dismal view of life and politics for ages. "Ditch Mitch" is the slogan 'round where I live...

 

[StanScratch]

What did you guys think about Mitch Daniels rebuttal last night? Could he be anymore of a downer. Jesus, listening to him you'd think that Armageddon was coming. Talk about playing on people's fear.

And herein lies a deep part of the problem.
Look at his rebuttal. Look at Newt's. They were not full of solutions nor answers - they were full of "this is why Obama is wrong!"
Stop trying to tell us what we should be afraid of. Let us know what we have to look forward to.
Stop telling us what is wrong with the other guy. Let us know what is right about you.
Stop telling us what should have been done in the past. Let us know what you are bringing to our future.
The scared little "doom and gloom" message is only getting them so far. And it might be working for their fringe members - but I believe that Republicans are going to find that those who are constantly living in fear of "the other guy" are not in the majority.

 

[Straight Shooter]

And herein lies a deep part of the problem.
Look at his rebuttal. Look at Newt's. They were not full of solutions nor answers - they were full of "this is why Obama is wrong!"
Stop trying to tell us what we should be afraid of. Let us know what we have to look forward to.
Stop telling us what is wrong with the other guy. Let us know what is right about you.
Stop telling us what should have been done in the past. Let us know what you are bringing to our future.
The scared little "doom and gloom" message is only getting them so far. And it might be working for their fringe members - but I believe that Republicans are going to find that those who are constantly living in fear of "the other guy" are not in the majority.

This part of Daniels' speech most stood out to me:
"In our economic stagnation and indebtedness, we are only a short distance behind Greece, Spain, and other European countries now facing economic catastrophe." Anyone who says the U.S. is the next Greece doesn't know what they're talking about. The GOP needs to stop the fear mongering.

 

[antanotherthing]

And herein lies a deep part of the problem.
Look at his rebuttal. Look at Newt's. They were not full of solutions nor answers - they were full of "this is why Obama is wrong!"
Stop trying to tell us what we should be afraid of. Let us know what we have to look forward to.
Stop telling us what is wrong with the other guy. Let us know what is right about you.
Stop telling us what should have been done in the past. Let us know what you are bringing to our future.
The scared little "doom and gloom" message is only getting them so far. And it might be working for their fringe members - but I believe that Republicans are going to find that those who are constantly living in fear of "the other guy" are not in the majority.

Amen

 

[Jenkum]

I can tell you, as an Independent, I sure as hell don't see a competent alternative on the Republican side. I tried but it just seems like they keep giving me a reason NOT to vote their way. I just keep doing this,.

The Republican field(minus Ron Paul) make Obama look great. A one eyed man is a king in the land of the blind. Thank God that the fanatical Xtians, Zionists, Neo-Cons, warmongers are not the majority in the US. I think everyone learned their lesson with Bush, America will not fall for that sort of candidate again. The Republican party has only had one talking point since Obama took office, the only thing they could talk about with their base was how bad Obama is. Republican media has been a non stop "bitch about Obama fest" with no real substance to back it up. It just comforts Republicans to turn on the TV and hear their favorite commentator whining about how bad Obama is, it's easy for Joe-Sixpack to nod his head in agreement without even having to think. In our super partisan, divided society, where politics may as well be professional footbal, the loosing team has to have something to cheer about even after their team loses. Obama has been the perfect villain for these out-dated, xenophobic, backward, racist, warmongering, war criminal, traitorous people to hate. That hatred has been catered to and cultivated by the Republican media. You always see the pathetic political hacks compete with each other in a competition over who can say the most outrageous and offensive things in regards to our President. They are all trying to peddle their "I HATE OBAMA" books to the mindless sheep who actually would buy books written by republican party hacks. I think if Gingrich would be the Republican nominee you will see many people who previously voted for Bush and even McCain vote this time for Obama, I believe that Gingrich is downright offensive to the majority of Americans, and he would bring people out of the woodwork to vote for Obama, people who even normally wouldnt bother voting would sign up just to keep Gingrich out. If the Media and the establishment did not hate Ron Paul so much then he could easily be elected by the people, If the people really chose the President then Ron Paul or someone like him would be president, instead of people who are always bought and paid for by Big Bankers. I firmly believe that even the stupid people who are currently loyal to Fox News and Right Wing talk radio, and have the ideology that has been put on them by this media, even this intellectual underclass of American idiot, could be brought to vote for Ron Paul, these sort of people only think what they currently think because of the programming they have recieved by their republican media. If the media was behind Ron Paul, everyone would be behind him.