The tone of porn is becoming uglier

SpexyAshleigh

Official Checked Star Member
I appreciate your honest answer. But I think you're on a slippery slope, as you try to apply (your?) moral standards, and wanting laws which reflect your beliefs.

Take this:


If this belief, well meaning though it may be, was used to create censorship laws for the betterment of society (or "men" as you put it), why couldn't/shouldn't we apply that same standard to Hollywood movies and TV shows as well??? I wonder how many cold blooded murders I've seen on TV since I was a child? I wonder how many robberies and other illegal activities I've seen? I wonder how many mobsters I've seen glorified? In one episode of The Sopranos, most everything that you object to would be right there... minus the hardcore sex. Should The Sopranos have been banned on moral grounds?

Cigarettes are bad for you. Alcohol and illicit drugs are bad for you. And this type of porn may be bad for you too. Some groups here (Evangelicals and radical feminists) strongly claim that ALL pornography is bad and should be banned - including what you do on webcams. Some people want to deal with things that are (claimed to be) bad for us by having the government pass social engineering laws to protect us from ourselves, thereby creating a nanny state of sorts. I believe in free choice. If you don't like something, don't partake in it.

you know, you are right. And I DO believe there is too much violence and sex on tv/movies...even in music, I believe it to be too vulgar. But this discussion wasn't started about movies/tv/music and the moral ground of these mediums. The discussion was made about pornography and the question of how far is too far. If you want, we can open up the topic of how far tv and movies should go?
 

SpexyAshleigh

Official Checked Star Member
I'm not here to offend, and certainly everyone has the right to viewing whatever gets them off...I just think that the kind of violence depicted in these types of adult material could only inspire more violence towards women IRL. The guys who think its sexy for a woman to be beat up, choked, raped etc...are guys that should probably be seeking help. Hate all you want, but being aroused by a woman being raped is not normal. Just like fantasizing about children isn't normal, or fantasizing about your sister isn't normal, or fantasizing about committing a murder, or even suicide...etc. Things that cause violence towards another human being should not be things that are glorified, applauded or masturbated to. I'm sounding preachy, and I'm genuinely trying not to, because I have a very open mind about alot of things and hate when other people come down on me...so I'll let this be my last post on this topic. But I don't understand how alot of material out there can be considered legit, and legal. Obviously there are some fine lines, and as time progresses, those lines will become more and more blurry, but...I think there is a good lot of stuff out there that should simply not exist. Two consenting adults being rough with each other - fine. But movies simulating actual rape? Thats certainly taking it too far.
 
This thread has made me realize why I dislike Hardcore porn nowdays. If you were looking for + rep, torontoguy, you just got it. Great post! :thumbsup:
 

Rey C.

Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
I'm not here to offend, and certainly everyone has the right to viewing whatever gets them off...I just think that the kind of violence depicted in these types of adult material could only inspire more violence towards women IRL. The guys who think its sexy for a woman to be beat up, choked, raped etc...are guys that should probably be seeking help. Hate all you want, but being aroused by a woman being raped is not normal. Just like fantasizing about children isn't normal, or fantasizing about your sister isn't normal, or fantasizing about committing a murder, or even suicide...etc. Things that cause violence towards another human being should not be things that are glorified, applauded or masturbated to. I'm sounding preachy, and I'm genuinely trying not to, because I have a very open mind about alot of things and hate when other people come down on me...so I'll let this be my last post on this topic. But I don't understand how alot of material out there can be considered legit, and legal. Obviously there are some fine lines, and as time progresses, those lines will become more and more blurry, but...I think there is a good lot of stuff out there that should simply not exist. Two consenting adults being rough with each other - fine. But movies simulating actual rape? Thats certainly taking it too far.


I'm certainly not offended by anything you've said. I may not agree with you on certain points, but I've enjoyed the discussion, which is why I gave you positive rep. I also find some types of porn too extreme (for my taste), and other porn I just find to be boring. I miss the glam porn from the 80's, actually. I don't particularly care to watch a girl with a bad boob job, piercings and tats getting banged by some skinhead looking guy who looks like he just got out of prison last week. That seems to be the norm now. That's my beef... so I actually don't look at very much hardcore porn these days. Scat, bukkake, gagging, spitting, girls showing cum in their mouths and gang bangs also don't appeal to me... so I don't watch those things.

There are so many niches in porn these days. And with the internet, porn is truly global now. So if a person doesn't like one thing, he/she can probably find something that does appeal to them. Or, they may prefer not to watch porn at all. If someone is seeing "rough" porn, it's only because they've sought it out. It won't jump on your screen unless you click on the link or buy a DVD at your local shop. Like I said, I generally believe that people should be able to make personal choices (good ones and bad ones) as they see fit. Their choice may be very different from the choice that I would make. But theirs is on them and mine is on me.

When it comes to what consenting adults do, I tend to side with free choice 99 times out of 100... whether it's something that I'm into or not. Again, good discussion. :thumbsup:
 
Porn has become too gimicky with all that degradation crap they try to sell which is probably part of the reason why people rather get their porn fix for free online then dish out alot of cash for a product that doesn't cater to their taste. I tend to fast forward to the fucking scenes and watch porn with the mute button on so I don't have to be annoyed by hearing some porn star actress loudly faking her moans while some douchbag verbally abuses while he gets his dick sucked by her.
 
If people stop watching it, they will stop making it. They only make what is selling.

:bowdown: This sums it all up for me. Pornography is a business.
If the DVD’s or websites of girls being treated rough makes more money than “normal” porn, Whatcha gonna do? Money makes the world go round.
 

Patrick_S

persona non grata
Just like fantasizing about children isn't normal, or fantasizing about your sister isn't normal, or fantasizing about committing a murder, or even suicide...etc.
Thinking about suicide is the most "normal" thing there is. I bet 99.9% of every human being that have ever lived have thought about suicide at some point in their life.
 

Will E Worm

Conspiracy...
These people know what they are getting themselves into.

They don't have any excuses.


You are watching the wrong stuff. The answer to all your woes: Europorn. The girls are prettier, there is only little degradation and hardly any douchy talk involved.

Too much DP and gangbangs in Europorn, also pee and other things.

Also, they have nuts like Cindy Hope who thinks just because she didn't do anal in her gangbang gauntlet video that it was classy. :1orglaugh:crash:

She also divorced her husband to further her porn career. :rolleyes:
 
These people know what they are getting themselves into.

They don't have any excuses.




Too much DP and gangbangs in Europorn, also pee and other things.

Also, they have nuts like Cindy Hope who thinks just because she didn't do anal in her gangbang gauntlet video that it was classy. :1orglaugh:crash:

She also divorced her husband to further her porn career. :rolleyes:

and you're suppose to be a bible thumper?....Nvm

anyway back on "topic"


this is the reason why i do not watch too many HC porn. I'm more on the glam/topless/centerfolds side. I love my SC glamour models
 
All that Facial Abuse/ The Minnion type material is bullshit. A lot of this 'not quite rape' porn with creepy outta shape abusive stepfather type dudes needs to go. It was played out when Max Hardcore was doing it and it's played out now.

Now we also have lame-ass dudes wearing strap-ons fucking girls as well. Is this what it all has come to??? Spraying chicks in the face with pina colada mix??? We got male pornstars, with 100's of scenes, that have never fucked anyone! Is it too much to ask to get back to the mid 90's material?

I think 92'-02' had the best porn ever. Variety and quality was top notch from the major distributors. Anabolic/Diabolic, Vivid, Elegant Angel, Seymore Butts/Shane, Video Team, Evil Angel, etc... were great all across the board. No gimmicks... no bullshit so-called fetishes. It's about damn time porn goes back to getting it right.

One way to stop this kind of porn is to get the female pornstars to stop signing up to do this kind of porn. Ever think maybe it's not just guys who are into that kind of stuff.

If people stop watching it, they will stop making it. They only make what is selling.

I totally agree with all points above. It's not so much what people are watching, but more what they're buying. This crap is being spent on all the time creating other entities trying to get a piece of the action. Now the market is being flooded with gimmicky/rape style porn. Porn parodys are the new 'in' gimmick. Everybodys got a porn parody out now from The Cosby Show to Good Times to Dukes of Hazzard to Cheers. It was intresting the first time, but now it's a runaway train. Even though it corny, it's still 10x better than that sexual assault on cam garbage.

Porn distributors need to understand that porn sells like crack sells. You don't need to put a new spin on crack to sell it successfully, the original recipe works just fine. As simplistic as GGW is, it sells like hot shit! It high time we stop buying this offensive, low quality bullshit and supporting the few that still get it right in the porn industry.
 
I've written on and on about women pornstars needing to unionize in order to operate under the safe conditions that they require but for which the present douchebag porn companies don't feel necessary to provide on a shoot.

The legal system is prejudiced against porn. Waiting around for society to solve porn problems is a waste of time.

Women need to unionize and bring about the change that they want (and most porn consumers want) too.
 

Will E Worm

Conspiracy...
I've written on and on about women pornstars needing to unionize in order to operate under the safe conditions that they require but for which the present douchebag porn companies don't feel necessary to provide on a shoot.

Porn is the one place that does not need a union. :tongue:

It's sex in front a camera. Deal with it or don't do it. :hatsoff:
 
When a bunch of chimps that didn't know how to make good porn but where able to do it because technology allowed them to do cheaply and easily it was pretty much the downfall of it. It created a situation where everybody tried to outdo each other in nastiness, and it created an even bigger mockery of itself than it already was. Of course with everything so saturated with garbage it's going to take a long time for it to ever get better, if ever. Who knows maybe when a lot of people go under because porn is doing so bad financially it will allow the cream to rise to the top again and for most of the losers have their asses sent packing. It might take a lot of time, but this might be a good point to turn it back around.

I do think it's not just about market forces anymore. With all the people that complain about it and with all the normal men out there that don't like that crap I have a hard time feeling everybody likes that stuff so that's the main reason they produce it. Some people on here are saying that if people don't like it they shouldn't buy it, but they fail to realize that there just isn't really anything good to buy anymore. If there is, it's a rare thing indeed. If it exist at all it’s usually lesser well known, often doesn't have as good production quality, and often doesn’t always have a lot of the good stars in it. It's not like there is a vast quantity of good stuff or hardly any at all that the people that don't like that crap can go to. It's kind of hard for something to outsell something else when it barely exist in the first place. It's like porn has fallen into a mindset that that's what they must make and a THIS IS WHAT WE THINK IS GOOD, YOU WILL LIKE IT OR ELSE mentality. Out of most industries out there, maybe almost all of them, porn is a lot more detached from reality and how normal people think than anything else.

There are no more “stars” of porn. No company wants to take time to do it right. In a long time, I haven’t seen any of them take the time or effort to promote their people like they should. They make no effort to have their performers appeal to the general masses of people that mike like erotic stuff, or to put them in a good light. They don’t try to make productions that everybody involved would enjoy doing let alone (gasp) might even be proud of. They make no effort to put any real eroticism or sensualist in it. They don’t treat performers like people or have them act like actual people might in their scenes. Nobody wants to make an effort to try to make this a viable career for any of the performers for any good length of time like in the past. Everybody just wants the quickest easiest money and that’s it.

What people also need to keep in mind is that with hardcore performers, with the exception of a very small handful of the very very top women, they have very little leverage in the industry. That was true even in porn’s best time. A lot of them are lead to believe that porn will lead to success that it almost certainly won't. A lot of them are barely mature young woman that don't have the wisdom or intelligence needed to make smart decisions or to keep themselves from being exploited, and there are a lot of people in porn willing to exploit anybody or anything. The actresses in porn generally don't make as much money as people think and some of them do it out desperation or they have little alternative.

Technically, they don't have to do anything (With the exception of maybe some that have some abusing boyfriend or pimp or something like that.), they don't have somebody sticking a gun to their head, but for the vast majority of them if they start making restricting demands, or get the “difficult” label that some producers just feels like giving for them because the woman didn’t do what they wanted they can vary easily be replaced and told to hit the door and take their careers with them. That is mostly after they have irrevocably already altered their lives by getting into it in the first place. Nobody is going to stick by them, and the workers in porn never stick together. Even years and years ago there were only a small portion of the pornstars that had any real influence and leverage about how they could operate their careers and stay in the industry and work, now it's even that much harder. If your a man that performs in porn you have no power at all unless you produce stuff or have friends that do. If a man, for example, didn't want to perform anal on a women they would probably be laughed out of the industry and shouldn't even bother. So it's not as simple as blaming the performers because they are willing to do it, although they do bear some responsibility. For a lot of them they have to choose between the crappy stuff and the end of their careers.

Porn of years ago had it flaws, but I'm also one of those people worried about young adults watching this crap and it slowly getting into our culture that this is the actual way they are supposed to be or are supposed to treat other people. I'm not saying it should be illegal, but I worry about it's effects, especially without people there to tell them their a bunch of idiots if they get off on that or think they should ever act that way. Porn the way it is today has turned sex into a joke. Another side effect is that the performes in it aren't as good looking or as good performing as they used to be. This is the most lackluster time in porn since before it's golden age. I'm sure a lot of the attractive women that might have though of performing and would have been all right with doing it the way porn used to be decided it wasn't worth it, not that I can blaim them, and we never got to see those people in the first place. The stars of the past are still remembered. They were real stars. I know about most of them from before I even started watching. In ten or twenty years do you think anybody is going to remember almost anybody from this era or think of them and their performances fondly or even give a damn about it at all?
 
Wow, so pleased to see a good discussion here!

I'm glad to see that I'm not alone in my concerns. For the record, I can totally understand that for many people, verbal abuse and other quasi-coercive stuff can be a legitimate part of their sex lives. People have power and control issues in their relationships, and that translates into bedroom activity too. I've never felt the need for that (I think power issues should be projected into the public/political sphere) but I suspect it is more common than not. Then of course there are those people who have too much power in their lives and get off on powerlessness in their sexual relationships, etc. etc.

But still, I think the prevalance of mean-spiritedness and misogyny in (at least American) porn is starting to be a problem. I agree with other posters here that too many of the performers aren't in a position to control what's going on in a shoot, which is a goddamn shame. And as I said earlier, really young kids have access (and DO access) hard coreporn. If it was just people joyously having sex and being good to each other, I really wouldn't care about that. In fact for most of human history, kids have been in the room/tent/cave when their parents were busy making them some siblings, and I really think it's not a big deal. But holy cow, they are learning (and kids are if nothing else learning machines) that women are there to be treated like shit and jerked off on. I think that is a kind of cultural poison. What will the long term consequences be? I hate to think.
 
Still, the devil is in the details.

I don't believe that all women (or even necessarily MOST women) find cum facials NECESSARILY humiliating or degrading. Intent surely plays a part in that, no?

Hair-pulling? Well, this is a great example of how much degree can matter. I've only done it a very small percentage of times myself when fucking/having sex/making love to a woman, but I have done it, and I've never had a bad response (maybe because I don't pull with the intent to hurt? - although I have given a good tug or two).

I'm all game for being on MY knees, licking my gal's crotch and having her hold my head in there with some force. But it's just play. I don't feel degraded by it.

Never really been into spanking too much, but I've put a few hand marks on a few bottoms in my day - again, never got anything but a little "ouch!" followed by a giggle or a chuckle.

Some of the choking stuff, especially when it seems to have the goal of simulating a rapist's chokehold, or to actually knock the girl OUT - that does disturb me. That said, plenty of people are known to engage in auto-erotic asphyxiation. Isn't that how Keith Carradine bit the dust??

But yeah, whenever a girl is clearly being given the "use her up and throw her out" treatment (and I find that this is usually exhibited mostly in the words being used and the actions of the dick-holders AFTER the fucking is over), it makes me feel uneasy.

There's no need for us to pretend that we're seeing a committed couple doing it a few weeks after their honeymoon (when, hopefully, there's plenty of spark!), but it needn't be some simulation of Mr. Total Asshole being a Royal Asshole on a hateful one-night stand, or Mr. Convicted Sex Offender having yanked a girl into a van or "tricked" a girl in order to use her as a cum receptacle.

I offer all this as the guy who started the "Fuck Her With Cum on Her Face" thread. Is that possible???
 
What will the long term consequences be? I hate to think.

In the U.S. we already see the consequences of a disconnected-from-reality culture with teen girls sending pix of their bodies to boys' cellphones, teen girls giving hummers on the bus, high school gangs creating gangbang initiations, etc.

I believe that my country's Constitution, while valuable in principal, has lived out its usefulness for America today. American society (and Western Societies) have advanced toward directions that nobody thought of 15 years ago.

We should be doing more to protect children from adult situations for which they are not mature enough to handle. Plain and simple. :hatsoff:
 
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