Shoud Turkey be a member of EU?

[georges]

I voted no as I do not like the idea of a European Union, as I feel it means countries lose there independance and national identity. I would like the EU dispanded and each country to set there own rules and guidelines on everything.

I too. The whole Europe of 27 is a fucking mess, economically and socially

 

[belfastsixpack]

Well technically Cuba is a socialist country but the anti-communists (some of whom also happen to be the anti-muslims as we see, there is a correlation) use the word socialism and communism interchangeably. A more socialist democracy is what nations like America must become in order to stop the poor getting poorer and the rich getting richer. I always advocate this change would come naturally if we adopted pure democracy, where the people vote on every issue and law that they feel to be important. That way the majority always gets what it wants unless it is in violation of equal rights laws or international laws. There would never be any wars, and the poor masses would be able to adjust their situation accordingly, instead of voting for one of two men which would lead to all their decisions being made for them for the next 4 or 5 years (which is the current system).

In any case, only time will tell if Turkey becomes an EU member or if the west becomes more socialized and starts taking care of its own, let alone sharing their extreme wealth with the rest of the world.

Fox

excellent post! I would rep if i could.

 

[ninetysixcavy]

Well technically Cuba is a socialist country but the anti-communists (some of whom also happen to be the anti-muslims as we see, there is a correlation) use the word socialism and communism interchangeably. A more socialist democracy is what nations like America must become in order to stop the poor getting poorer and the rich getting richer. I always advocate this change would come naturally if we adopted pure democracy, where the people vote on every issue and law that they feel to be important. That way the majority always gets what it wants unless it is in violation of equal rights laws or international laws. There would never be any wars, and the poor masses would be able to adjust their situation accordingly, instead of voting for one of two men which would lead to all their decisions being made for them for the next 4 or 5 years (which is the current system).

In any case, only time will tell if Turkey becomes an EU member or if the west becomes more socialized and starts taking care of its own, let alone sharing their extreme wealth with the rest of the world.

Fox

Too bad Mexico won't take care of their own:

http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,2117330,00.html?gusrc=rss&feed=24

And yet Mexico tells their people to flood America while regular Americans get robbed via depressed wages, increased taxes, lower life standards (increase in crime), outsourcing of jobs etc. etc. etc. The rich get richer and the middle class continues to decline. As far as Turkey, well, whatever. They're not European, and don't belong in the Union. Also, like other posters said, the Union is a joke anyway.

 

[ninetysixcavy]

And no, by the way, Mexico does not "tell their people to flood to America".

Fox

Really?

Migrant guide works against guest-worker plan

By U.S. REP. J.D. HAYWORTH

Mexico's Foreign Ministry has produced and distributed a Guide for the Mexican Migrant, which is essentially a "how to" manual for illegal entry into the United States.

Unfortunately, it goes even further by providing recommendations for illegal aliens in evading detection of federal authorities once in the United States. ("Avoid attracting attention," etc.) Not once does the guide mention how a Mexican migrant can come to the U.S. legally!

While many Americans were shocked to find out that the Mexican government is a witting accomplice in breaking our laws, the assault on our sovereignty by Mexico has been going on for years.

[...]

More

Precisely on your other points though. Mexico is one of the richest nations on the planet. Yet somehow our communist, elite, greedy politicians (financed by wealthy corporations looking for slave labor, the cheap bastards) spoon feed us this bullshit that we need this surplus of illegal aliens to fill "the jobs Americans won't do." Mexico's politicians are more corrupt than ours. That's pretty fucking sad.

 

[calpoon]

I know this is way Off Topic, sorry. It really doesn't make any sense that mexico would want to get rid of it's poor people. no oppresive capitalist system wants to get rid of the poor, in fact, the opposite, it wants to make sure that it keeps the poor and they stay poor and keep getting exploited by the rich. without them then they'd cut each others throats.

As for their politicians being more corrupt than American ones - how much blood and how many illegal invasions do the Mexican leaders have on their hands in the last several decades. I rest my case.

several, against it's own people. I know that we've discussed this before, so I'm not going to go into it much. But the mexican government is becoming increasingly right-wing and facist and it surpresses free speach, labor organizing and anti-government/capitalist activity on a level at least as much as the US historically and probably moreso currently.

There is no government more brutal and globally corrupt on a massive scale than ours.

true. That and the lack of a pressure valve for the american poor to release steam (by way of immigrating to find new opportunities better than what they have) is the only difference.

 

[Friday on my mind]

I know this is way Off Topic, sorry. It really doesn't make any sense that mexico would want to get rid of it's poor people. no oppresive capitalist system wants to get rid of the poor, in fact, the opposite, it wants to make sure that it keeps the poor and they stay poor and keep getting exploited by the rich. without them then they'd cut each others throats.

Calpoon you are right every capitalist system needs an underclass.But many countrys and mexico is one of them have a surplus they would like to be rid off.They only have the capacity to exploit so many and the rest they would just as soon see disappear.

 

[BNF]

If this thread must continue.... then get back to TURKEY.

 

[calpoon]

Do you know the quickest way I'd rather avoid Albania if possible.

go directly to Turkey, do not pass go, do not collect 200 dollars.

 

[alexios]

The result speaks for itself.

 

[calpoon]

the result of what? the poll?

I was thinking back on this thread today, and the country of Australia came to mind. It's peopel, it's history and culture, and until recently it's primary political and economic partners were deeply European.

If they want to base it on those factors (and indeed, not adhearing to them is one of the major argument(s) against admission of Turkey) then they should admit Australia to the EU.

 

[ninetysixcavy]

Someone removed my post (and rebutal to Fox). Whatever. I still think Mexico sucks.

 

[towbincouple]

Turkey is like United States, it is a mixture of different cultures...
There are some problems with Law System but it is not easy to change an old culture..
As for the European Union, i dont think any country should join EU, because Germany and France is abusing the rest of the Countries in EU. When you look at the history and proposal of EU, The Only goal is to eliminate steel competition between Germany and France...
You get into EU, then Germans and Frenchs will transfer your qualified labor to their companies, they will sell you their old cars, and you will be stuck with your low qualified labor...
Example:
look at czech Republic, Bulgaria, Most of The Eastern Europe...
They get happy for a little EU Financial Help, but in the long term they lose everything...
Bulgarian and Czech Companies cant find anybody to work for them because everybody knows english, german and has a degree moved to Germany and France...
So do you really wanna be their slaves?

 

[mrtrebus]

NO. Not until the Cyprus situation is properly sorted out.

 

[marquis2]

the result of what? the poll?

I was thinking back on this thread today, and the country of Australia came to mind. It's peopel, it's history and culture, and until recently it's primary political and economic partners were deeply European.

If they want to base it on those factors (and indeed, not adhearing to them is one of the major argument(s) against admission of Turkey) then they should admit Australia to the EU.

Not as far fetched as it seems. France has declared its overseas empire remnants to be part of Metropolitan France. So Martinique in the Caribbean is in the EU.Strangely, the Isle of Man isn't.

 

[Dirtybaggins]

What fairy tale world are you living in? I don't count all the Muslims that either condone the actions of overt terrorist that do the actual killing, or look the other way and don't say anything as innocent. You notice in how most civilized countries when the people in power do something that a large portion of the people don't like, even if there in the minority, there is always a huge group of them that are willing to speak out? That rarely seems to be the case with the practitioners of Islam. There sure is a hell of a lot more people dancing in the streets in favor of terrorism than there are people protesting it. There might be some here or there that try to speak out or there might be some that are not in fundamentalist countries but they are a rarity in them. If you count that it is a hell of a lot more than 1% of them, it's more like the vast majority unlike every other major religious group in the world. Only somebody like you could fail to and keep failing to open your eyes, be objective and realize the obviousness of it. No we are not the same, and the argument that everybody else is just as bad doesn't hold ground to anybody with a brain. You would have to go back hundreds of years to things like the Spanish Inquisition and the Crusades before you could find another large organized religion that is even as remotely as bad as the people practicing Islam are right now. Pretending we are just the same or they are just like us is not going to change the fact it isn't true. While there are bad people or every race, gender, creed, and religion in the world, Islam seems to have a much higher amount of them. There are more of them that are willing to kill innocents on the other side. There are more of them willing to force more control over others because of their beliefs than even other religions fundamentalist, and there is more of them that look the other way or secretly support the direct action of terrorist.


As far as Turkey goes I don't care because I'm not a member of the EU. However in my opinion it shouldn't get in regardless of its economic stasis until it improves upon human rights more.

You have some very valid points. Unfortunately you dont have to go anywhere. Plenty of, excuse the derogatory term but cant say I dont think its ridiculous, Ragheads in the west. Not content until we the infidel pig eaters are unders sharian law.

The base simple fact is this: Islam and governance arent separate, on top of this their religion hasnt modernized or kept up with the times in the slightest.
Its like fucking medieval dark ages christianity when the hated catholic (not by me) church ran europe and the pope could declare war on folks.

So no I dont want a big muslim country in my precious european superstate Americans dont want the EU and they have successfully encouraged British leaders to basically sit on the fence on the european issue which by extension has been bred into the publics bones, Well from the conservative side. Have stirred up old shit and ensured their worse nightmare never occured. Russia in the EU.

Exactly, half of Russia is in Europe, why the fack is europe messing about with a serious hyper inflated shithole with primative attitudes and a seriously shit human rights record when good orthodox christians are sitting in moscow?(err it did come back after communism) Did I mention that they also supply alot of the gas to europe now as well?

Are europeans going to be forever crying about old grievances and not looking at the bigger picture? As individuals states your identity is precious so is your sovereignty but you must also realise that the geopolitical landscape is larger than your national boundaries and that quite basically the bigger fish are running the show. In order to be able to friendly compete with the US and China, Likely even Russia. Europe must remain united and strengthen its ties. How would a overall EU government destroy your sense of culture and national identity? Yes proportional representation bullshit is no good, We need a senate to which prime minister or a countries leader is your senator....Each state then has a voice and a veto how the fuck would that not be fair?

You british guys need to wake the fuck up too, Your glory days of empire are long over. Stop your old hatin' and island mentality shit, Wake up and smell the coffee. Your riding Uncle Sam's coat tails and as soon as its no longer prudent you will get shafted. Dont get me wrong I dont hate my colonial cousins I just am a fucking realist Uncle Sam looks after itself, Just like we should look after ourshelves.

 

[Namreg]

Fuck NO
fuck turkey. if it is such a great country, then why are so many (millions, literally) turks living in germany? if turkey fixes its many, many problems, then yes; but until then they can kiss my german ass.

 

[288gto]

i don't know why my country at all is trying to enter the EU. they are just a group of useless douchies which we will have to pay. i'd rather tax them pig instead of letting them import in my country without being taxed, ask them for visa and time of stay, etc. just like they do to us. deep inside EU is obvious their pro nazi anti islamic and jewish ideology. i am an albanian, living in macedonia, and i think the EU is our great waste time and money, we rather see what we can do with out hands than wait from asshole douchies. you say turkey ain't in europe, but you support georgia, armenia, azebaigan or whatever.
i don't like turkey as well, but what EU does to turkey is worng and just show's your anti islamic ignorance. hitler did wrong to israelis, they suffered, but what they do today is wrong, if EU was a true peace loving shit, they would get between israel and palestine. EU are just pussy. EU sipports the golden shit in greece the nazzi assholes, so what are we waiting at all from EU?

 

[288gto]

turks are idiots, we all know that, but you want money brother, so keep'em now.

 

[Mr_Stiffy]

Well, aren't you a super-bumping, double-posting knuckle-dragger? And racist too? You'll fit in well here. Go sit in the sandpit, I'm sure 'bird can find you a nice bucket and spade.

Oh, congratulations on being from a nice country that produces beautiful women.

 

[288gto]

Well, aren't you a super-bumping, double-posting knuckle-dragger? And racist too? You'll fit in well here. Go sit in the sandpit, I'm sure 'bird can find you a nice bucket and spade.

Oh, congratulations on being from a nice country that produces beautiful women.

are you talking about my posts?