Obama Picks Biden for VP

[LBP 76]

He captured most of ben laden's lieutenants and captured saddam.
Also despite three bombings and terrorist attacks during Clinton's presidency, the 1st WTC bombing in 1993, the bombing of the USS Cole in 1996 and the bombing of the US Ambassy in Nairobi in Kenya in 1997, nothing was done by "beloved" Clinton to take serious and pragmatic actions against the people who perpetrated these bombings. This is what lead to 9/11because no actions have been taken in time to stop the threats and this was under Clinton's presidency.

I am not defending Clinton. I think his administration is over rated (except for fiscal responsibility, he did well there).
But Bush is useless on Bin Laden. 7 years after 9/11 and he and his No. 2 are still at large. That is pathetic.
And instead of sending America's military might to find them he has most of the troops rotting away in Iraq and leaving Bin Laden to...the Pakistani's who are VERY unmotivated to find him.
War on Terror? What a joke.

 

[86150]

that about sums it up right there, doesn't it?

they had a slogan in the 1970's: if you remember the 60's, you must not have been there.

the new slogan for the 90's: if you like Reagan in the 80's, you must not have been there.


Originally Posted by 86150
I vote the way Jesus tells me to. All you liberals are out of touch with reality.

:rofl::rofl:

I'm not sure why you are trying to say I posted that, but you are a liar.I never posted that. You made that up. What's your deal?

 

[86150]

Good point. So I guess that means we can't trust McCain because of the shamefully way he cheated on his first wife with a number of woman!

woman should be WOMEN. And in this election I won't be voting for McCain so much as AGAINST obama/biden.

 

[Friday on my mind]

woman should be WOMEN. And in this election I won't be voting for McCain so much as AGAINST obama/biden.

So not all people who cheat on their wives are disqualified or can't be trusted only the liberal ones I guess?? You could vote for one of the 3rd party candidates,Barr,Nader as examples and still not vote for the cheater or Obama.

 

[NinaDeponca]

Yes, and the 16000000 jobs created during his presidency and the annueal economical growth rate of 3.4% each year were also a side of the mask perhaps??? Please get real.
Even middle class people were happy of Reagan's presidency.
" According to columnist Chuck Raasch, "Reagan transformed the American presidency in ways that only a few have been able to." He redefined the political agenda of the times, advocating lower taxes, a liberal economic philosophy, and a stronger military. His role in the Cold War further enhanced his image as a different kind of leader.
.

Lets be clear - just because Americans approved of Reagan doesn't mean he was great or effective. If you truely understand economics and analyzed the so called boom you will truely understand what happened.

1. Taxes were lowered for the rich and corporate America. So yes there was a boom

2. The USA Went from the Greatest Creditor nation in the World to the Greatest Debtor nation in the World

3. Budget deficits grew

4. American had a false sense of their own security

If you know anything about business and what went on in the 80's with wall street and junk bonds - Basically thats what the republicans did with Americas future. We borrowed from future generations of the middle class to pay for a lifestyle today. Eventually, a lot of those companies that used leverage and junk bonds to finance their business went bankrupt. The same thing is happening today. All this national debt is crushing the average middleclass American. In the mean while, the rich are getting richer, poorer are getting poorer, tax payers are getging squeezed.

Ross Perot had it right when he said we shouldn't be asking future generations to bail us out of this mess. We are seriously paying for it now. Reagan was a fraud. A mediocre actor who also was a liar, and one of them most intellectually non curious presidents we ever had, except for BUSH.

Bush is a fraud, he kept talking up his religious values while frothing at the mouth to go to war for false reasons. When one reason didn't stick, he used another reason. First it was weapons of mass destruction, then it was freedom for Iraqis, give me a break. The whole establishment of this country was asleep at the wheel while this idiot trampled on the constitution. God please give that fraudster what he deserves

 

[NinaDeponca]

I would rather trust someone with integrity and honesty than a liar under oath accused of perjury who is also an unbelievable UN ass kisser.

What the hell does his sex life have to do with him governing this country? The only reason Bill was questioned about his sex life was they had nothing on him and they knew he would lie (Like 100 percent of married men would about an affair)

50 million dollars was spent on the white water case - the prosecutor had nothing. Getting Bill to lie about having sex was an out for the prosecutor.

If you are going to condemn Bill Clinton for doing something just about all Americans have done, then according to you - nobody is good enough to be president. Furthermore, are you so naaive to think Reagan hasn't lied? That Bush 1 and Bush 2 hasn't lied?

One of the most desturbing things I have noticed with the electorate of this country is that they want to hold a human being to higher standards than they are willing to hold themselves to. Hippocrites

 

[calpoon]

I would rather trust someone with integrity and honesty than a liar under oath accused of perjury who is also an unbelievable UN ass kisser.

why do I get a feeling of deja vu?
actually this conversation has already happened before, with both of us saying pretty much 90% of the exact same words in the sentances. No, I don't mean in a past life, it was back in march. I did a board search. heh.

I'm not sure why you are trying to say I posted that, but you are a liar.I never posted that. You made that up. What's your deal?

that was a joke.

Ya know, as far as i'm concerned it's like Raygun - Bad, Clit'on -worse, Bush Jr. - worst.

and Bush Sr. is like an combination of all three. But he seemed to understand that the president is just the idiot who gets blamed for screwing things up, and he could accomplish things more effectivly behind the scenes. I'll give him that one.

You say that you don't really like McCain, but you don't want to vote for Obama. Well, I can get you right there. I don't really like either of them, and neither do most people. that's fucked up. what happened here?

As far as the subject goes... I think I saw it a few pages back.

I don't really know anything about bidden. I saw Bill Maher talking about him a few days ago, he (bidden) was saying when asked about the Vp potential: "I'm not the guy." and Maher said, "he's not the guy? ah, I see. so what he really is saying is that he is the guy. Is this like reverse psychlogy?"

He sure nailed that one.

 

[NinaDeponca]

The 80's boom was fueled by baby boomers, not Reaganomics.
Baby boomers (born 1946-1963 or so) started to reach their peak spending years in the 80's. And they entered the real estate market. The same thing happened when easy credit brought MANY new buyers into the real estate market after 9/11 withe same result. A housing boom. And the housing market is by far the biggest part of the US economy. And second is the auto industry. And when people make piles of cash they buy bigger homes and nicer cars.
Reagan just had good timing. Besides, many countries like Japan, Germany, Canada, Great Britian, etc. had huge growth in the 80's as well. And Reagan wasn't their President.

Ask any astute financier/investor. The 80's boom was fueled by baby boomers, not government taxation policies.


Sorry to go off topic. I am done with Reagan here.

A lot of what you said is correct - but also the tax policies because basically rather than trim the budgets as taxes was reduced Reagan beleived bigger business would create greater revenue for the government to meet its obligations. But what really happened was the government had to borrow to make up the short fall (budget deficts)

All that borrowing was for the military buildup / arms race and put this nation into the greatest Debtor nation status. The soviet union was doing the same thing, however because of the kind of economy the Soviet Union was, they couldn't sustain a buildup the same way the USA could. They couldn't borrow like the USA could. That is in my opinion the only good thing Reagan did in the 80's - Arms Raced the Soviet Union into Bankruptcy. Other than that - the boom was on the back of Crushing debt that is comming home to ROOST

 

[Torre82]

The oil speculators arent to be completely blamed for a rise in per-barrel because the market is too competitititive for them to get thoroughly rich, although yes.. they are there to make money YET it would take ALL of them to synchronize and cooperate with each other (that'd be a logistical and cluttery nightmare) on a huge scale to even BEGIN truly fixing the per-barrel prices. They can also RAISE the prices after, IMMEDIATELY AFTER:

Nigeria gets in a conflict!
Iran announces progress in their nuclear program!
A mouse farts in the middle of the forest.
~~
They act on hunches. They *ASSUME* and that works out in our favor. Not very well, but if ya get rid of 'em then.. well we're a little worse off.

Originally Posted by 86150
I vote the way Jesus tells me to. All you liberals are out of touch with reality.

 

[Friday on my mind]

The oil speculators arent to be completely blamed for a rise in per-barrel because the market is too competitititive for them to get thoroughly rich, although yes.. they are there to make money YET it would take ALL of them to synchronize and cooperate with each other (that'd be a logistical and cluttery nightmare) on a huge scale to even BEGIN truly fixing the per-barrel prices. They can also RAISE the prices after, IMMEDIATELY AFTER:

Nigeria gets in a conflict!
Iran announces progress in their nuclear program!
A mouse farts in the middle of the forest.
~~
They act on hunches. They *ASSUME* and that works out in our favor. Not very well, but if ya get rid of 'em then.. well we're a little worse off.

And if their "speculation" is wrong they lose money.They are betting on future prices.Personally I think it is a pretty safe bet prices will be higher,the real speculation is how much higher.This nonsense that the US with the small amount of oil that is beleived to be able to found and drilled for is really a major factor for oil speculators is just that, nonsense.The real speculation is over the kinds of things you mention, will the political strife in Nigeria cause a disruption in their exports,or something that happens with Iran like a military conflict and them sinking a tanker in the straits of hermose which would block almost all exports of oil from the oil gulf countries(that would be a catastrophe for oil supplys). The Iranians having the bomb would put some worry in the markets and drive speculative prices up as well,but actual military action would really do a lot more than that.So in effect attacking them would probably be like cutting off our nose to spite our face as they say.I again say better come up with new sources of sustainable and clean cause were killing the enviorment major sources of energy.UN recently said world needs like 1500 new nuclear power plants and lots of wind power over next couple decades,I think they have the right idea.

 

[calpoon]

you know what expression, when you "assume" you make an "ass" out of "u" and "me."?

why am I an ass just because someone else is making assumptions? I shouldn't be included in this. I think the expression should go: when you make assumptions, fuck you.

 

[JohnnyThompson]

Here is the funny thing - Before Reagan the USA was the largest creditor nation. The USA is now the greatest debtor nation. All the wealth and success of the Regan Era was a mask. The rich got richer, poor got poorer, and trickle down economics did not trickle down. Basically what happened during his presidency is what happens under every Republican President. WEALTH TRANSFER TO THE RICH by reversing all the gains for the middle class during the previous democratic administration.

I have a mixed view of Clinton - Yes he lied about his affair. However, in my personal belief, it is beneath a sitting president to have to answer questions about his personal life. And the only reason it happened was because the prosecutor for the white water scandle had nothing. He spent over 50 million investigating Clinton and all he could come up with was the sexual issues. Its funny how Americans are so quick to condemn Clinton for his Affair when in general so many Americans have had Affairs. Furthermore, Clinton was the most outstanding president during my lifetime. Under his Presidency Crime went down nationally, home ownership went up dramatically, unemployment want down dramatically, more businesses where started, there was no budget deficit by his last term, the national debt went down. There are so many other things. Ohh yes, The USA was regared very favorably around the world.

Now you say that Clinton was a UN kisser. So you beleived that Bush2 was not a UN kisser - which maybe true but look at the price. We basically went it alone to IRAQ and spend roughly 8 BILLION a month in IRAQ. We (the USA) had so much goodwill that was squandered because bush lied to the UN to go to war. Its Ironiq that a draft doger would be the one to put people in harms way for his agenda.

I am so affraid of the Future of this nation. We are falling behind in so many ways, its freightening

Clinton was a wonderful president domestically, because he really did not follow the fundamental platform of FDR's Democratic Party. He reduced the size of government rather than expand it. However, his dovish attitude allowed terrorist organizations to plot against the United States during a time where there was many unstable and vulnerable nations being forged due to the collapse of the Soviet Union.

Just like Clinton inherited Reagan's large national debt, George W. Bush inherited Clinton's inability/unwillingness to thwart terrorist activity. And for better or for worse 9/11 has defined George W. Bush's presidency. Many things would have been done differently had that event never occurred.

As for Clinton's impeachment/extramarital affairs, it only deserves mentioning at the bottom of any assessment of his presidency as a mere footnote.

 

[JohnnyThompson]

A lot of what you said is correct - but also the tax policies because basically rather than trim the budgets as taxes was reduced Reagan beleived bigger business would create greater revenue for the government to meet its obligations. But what really happened was the government had to borrow to make up the short fall (budget deficts)

All that borrowing was for the military buildup / arms race and put this nation into the greatest Debtor nation status. The soviet union was doing the same thing, however because of the kind of economy the Soviet Union was, they couldn't sustain a buildup the same way the USA could. They couldn't borrow like the USA could. That is in my opinion the only good thing Reagan did in the 80's - Arms Raced the Soviet Union into Bankruptcy. Other than that - the boom was on the back of Crushing debt that is comming home to ROOST

Glasnost and Gorbachev's revocation of the Brezhnev Doctrine played a greater roll than Reagan outspending the Soviet Union.

As for the baby boomers coming of age...although that too factored into the prosperity of the 80s, a lot also had to do with the deregulation of many industries, the reformation of the tax system and the introduction of more investment opportunities.

 

[georges]

Clinton was a wonderful president domestically, because he really did not follow the fundamental platform of FDR's Democratic Party. He reduced the size of government rather than expand it. However, his dovish attitude allowed terrorist organizations to plot against the United States during a time where there was many unstable and vulnerable nations being forged due to the collapse of the Soviet Union.

Just like Clinton inherited Reagan's large national debt, George W. Bush inherited Clinton's inability/unwillingness to thwart terrorist activity. And for better or for worse 9/11 has defined George W. Bush's presidency. Many things would have been done differently had that event never occurred.

As for Clinton's impeachment/extramarital affairs, it only deserves mentioning at the bottom of any assessment of his presidency as a mere footnote.

great post:hatsoff:enjoy the rep

 

[georges]

Glasnost and Gorbachev's revocation of the Brezhnev Doctrine played a greater roll than Reagan outspending the Soviet Union.

As for the baby boomers coming of age...although that too factored into the prosperity of the 80s, a lot also had to do with the deregulation of many industries, the reformation of the tax system and the introduction of more investment opportunities.

I couldn't agree more with you. :yesyes:

 

[86150]

So not all people who cheat on their wives are disqualified or can't be trusted only the liberal ones I guess?? You could vote for one of the 3rd party candidates,Barr,Nader as examples and still not vote for the cheater or Obama.

Didn't say that, but the fact is that I believe that the country can stand 4 years of McCain much better than 4 years of a person like obama.

I won't do that simply because I really want to make sure my vote goes where it does the most good. Nader is a joke and there are things I just don't care for with Barr.

 

[86150]

why do I get a feeling of deja vu?
actually this conversation has already happened before, with both of us saying pretty much 90% of the exact same words in the sentances. No, I don't mean in a past life, it was back in march. I did a board search. heh.



that was a joke.

Ya know, as far as i'm concerned it's like Raygun - Bad, Clit'on -worse, Bush Jr. - worst.

and Bush Sr. is like an combination of all three. But he seemed to understand that the president is just the idiot who gets blamed for screwing things up, and he could accomplish things more effectivly behind the scenes. I'll give him that one.

You say that you don't really like McCain, but you don't want to vote for Obama. Well, I can get you right there. I don't really like either of them, and neither do most people. that's fucked up. what happened here?

As far as the subject goes... I think I saw it a few pages back.

I don't really know anything about bidden. I saw Bill Maher talking about him a few days ago, he (bidden) was saying when asked about the Vp potential: "I'm not the guy." and Maher said, "he's not the guy? ah, I see. so what he really is saying is that he is the guy. Is this like reverse psychlogy?"

He sure nailed that one.

Oh OK it is just that you never know what a person's intentions are when something like that happens. No big deal, I get ya.

To me personally Maher blew any credibility he ever had with me a LONG time ago.

I can't figure out why that guy is so Pissed off ALL THE TIME. Like he is mad at the world.

 

[86150]

The oil speculators arent to be completely blamed for a rise in per-barrel because the market is too competitititive for them to get thoroughly rich, although yes.. they are there to make money YET it would take ALL of them to synchronize and cooperate with each other (that'd be a logistical and cluttery nightmare) on a huge scale to even BEGIN truly fixing the per-barrel prices. They can also RAISE the prices after, IMMEDIATELY AFTER:

Nigeria gets in a conflict!
Iran announces progress in their nuclear program!
A mouse farts in the middle of the forest.
~~
They act on hunches. They *ASSUME* and that works out in our favor. Not very well, but if ya get rid of 'em then.. well we're a little worse off.

One idea I heard about the speculators and the rapid rise in oil prices, was this. Make them actually PAY FOR and TAKE DELIVERY of the oil that they are making the deals on. That would slow the rise tremendously when that kind of thing happens.

Well except for that Mouse Farting thing...That really is hell to deal with.

 

[86150]

I am not defending Clinton. I think his administration is over rated (except for fiscal responsibility, he did well there).
But Bush is useless on Bin Laden. 7 years after 9/11 and he and his No. 2 are still at large. That is pathetic.
And instead of sending America's military might to find them he has most of the troops rotting away in Iraq and leaving Bin Laden to...the Pakistani's who are VERY unmotivated to find him.
War on Terror? What a joke.

That I really do agree with you on. Bin Laden won't ever be caught, he will die first. He SHOULD HAVE been priority ONE!

 

[JohnnyThompson]

Oh OK it is just that you never know what a person's intentions are when something like that happens. No big deal, I get ya.

To me personally Maher blew any credibility he ever had with me a LONG time ago.

I can't figure out why that guy is so Pissed off ALL THE TIME. Like he is mad at the world.

Mahr is your typical arm chair quarterback. He brings up some good points now and again and he is an intelligent man, but all he does is complain and complain and he often times contradicts himself. I remember hearing him describe himself as a libertarian then, he started talking about how he wants a champion of socialism as president.