Re: What about ... ???
You've asked a lot of questions, questions you know there is no answer for, in the hope that "proves" something. The reality is that we can ask a lot of questions that we will never get an answer for.
As much as you try to make your narrow focus "the real issue" and everything else being a "spin" or "don't know what I'm talking about," I can easily pose a return question that basically says, "yeah, the 'big picture' is that scary, isn't it?"
Heck, holding anyone against their will is "illegal," let alone subjecting them to sleep deprivation, long and physically strenuous positions, etc... has been considered "illegal" by many.
Yet it has been done against American citizens in prisons, sometimes without prosecution in jails. And most things on the DoJ list alone have been regular, acknowledge form of interrogation by a great number of western nations.
All the CIA has admitted to is three (3) uses of water boarding post-9/11. That's all we have. Doesn't mean it's remotely true, let alone even being to count the number of "indirect" torture events the US has been an "indirect" party to.
So if you want to solely focus on only that, let alone try to call what the DoJ released as "orders" (and you claim I'm "spinning" things?), is getting old. Let's focus on the greater issues, including why the DoJ list came about.
You want to argue narrow-minded, politically-aligned rhetoric. I want to argue reality.
I've also pointed out the real fact that Obama is merely trying to be a leader, much like Ford did the same. That if people want to dig the hole, they'll find a lot of people buried in it. The only thing you can do is make it an Executive Order so their is no doubt left going forward. I respect Obama for just finally doing that, and putting the bullshit aside, much like Ford did as well.
People many people have done many things without it being acknowledged. What happened post-9/11 was that everyone in the western world got involved, and what used to be smaller engagements and intelligence efforts suddenly became large, unified, coordinated ones. And actions that were lesser known became far more greatly known, and the rest is cause-effect.
Heck, even the fact that JFK personally approved the assassination of the leader of South Vietnam was not known for many, many years later. Because if you dig the whole, be careful who you might find buried there, and by whom. There are a lot of dead people in the world due to various US leaders -- from JFK to W. -- and we can
Even as I pointed out, I found it a great irony that Kofi praised Harry, when many focus on the issues he created, including the deaths by his orders -- some of which people still call atrocities and demonize the US for to this day.
Obama understands this, just like Ford did.
That's obvious. You are utterly missing the context I'm pointing out, which explains why history repeats itself. The more people like yourself want to focus narrowly on one, party-aligned view, the more you miss all the surrounding issues that extends across many.
Well let me ask a question. When has the US ever punished for water boarding? Or torture in general?! Answer me that!
You've asked a lot of questions, questions you know there is no answer for, in the hope that "proves" something. The reality is that we can ask a lot of questions that we will never get an answer for.
As much as you try to make your narrow focus "the real issue" and everything else being a "spin" or "don't know what I'm talking about," I can easily pose a return question that basically says, "yeah, the 'big picture' is that scary, isn't it?"
What law has been made that says water boarding is illegal? Seriously?!
Heck, holding anyone against their will is "illegal," let alone subjecting them to sleep deprivation, long and physically strenuous positions, etc... has been considered "illegal" by many.
Yet it has been done against American citizens in prisons, sometimes without prosecution in jails. And most things on the DoJ list alone have been regular, acknowledge form of interrogation by a great number of western nations.
All the CIA has admitted to is three (3) uses of water boarding post-9/11. That's all we have. Doesn't mean it's remotely true, let alone even being to count the number of "indirect" torture events the US has been an "indirect" party to.
So if you want to solely focus on only that, let alone try to call what the DoJ released as "orders" (and you claim I'm "spinning" things?), is getting old. Let's focus on the greater issues, including why the DoJ list came about.
And yet you won't answer my own for the same reasons. There are no answers. There is only speculation, accusation and endless, political arguments.
You want to argue narrow-minded, politically-aligned rhetoric. I want to argue reality.
I've also pointed out the real fact that Obama is merely trying to be a leader, much like Ford did the same. That if people want to dig the hole, they'll find a lot of people buried in it. The only thing you can do is make it an Executive Order so their is no doubt left going forward. I respect Obama for just finally doing that, and putting the bullshit aside, much like Ford did as well.
People many people have done many things without it being acknowledged. What happened post-9/11 was that everyone in the western world got involved, and what used to be smaller engagements and intelligence efforts suddenly became large, unified, coordinated ones. And actions that were lesser known became far more greatly known, and the rest is cause-effect.
Heck, even the fact that JFK personally approved the assassination of the leader of South Vietnam was not known for many, many years later. Because if you dig the whole, be careful who you might find buried there, and by whom. There are a lot of dead people in the world due to various US leaders -- from JFK to W. -- and we can
Even as I pointed out, I found it a great irony that Kofi praised Harry, when many focus on the issues he created, including the deaths by his orders -- some of which people still call atrocities and demonize the US for to this day.
Obama understands this, just like Ford did.
