Muhammad Ali... THE Champ, dead at 74

[claydavis]

R.I.P Muhammad Ali

 

[sean miguel]

he was the greatest boxer ever, but before you lionize this guy, he was a narcissist and a braggart to the extreme. And contrary to his wisdom, even if you can back it up, it's still bragging, especially if you can back it up, as it should be self evident. Show some subtlety and/or class.


A great boxer but a shitty human being.

Too soon?

 

[Rey C.]

Drown a drink of water and kill a dead tree. Wait til you see Muhammad Ali!

Hells yeah. :bowdown: The man turned trash talkin' into an art. The Show was a big part of why he was so revered. No one before or since has been able to do what he did, the way that he did it. But whether revered or reviled, Ali was Ali.

 

[larss]

RIP Champ.

 

[Jagger69]

A great boxer but a shitty human being.

Too soon?

What a crock of shit. It was showmanship, pure and simple. Ali was the greatest promoter boxing ever had. Considered a major sport in the 1950s, boxing had begun to wane in popularity with the emergence of Pro Football and the continued infatuation with MLB into the 1960s. Ali single-handedly brought the sport back to the forefront. Sure, he was cocky and brash and arrogant as a boxer....it was all a part of the schtick. His persona was what brought people back to boxing. After his retirement, it became obvious that he was truly a man of peace and generosity. Even though he suffered terribly from a grave disease on his own, he still had the compassion to give in both time and money to many worthwhile charities:

https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/muhammad-ali

If Ali was a "shitty" person as you claim, we should all be so "shitty". The world would be a much better place.

 

[Chatintime]

Too young to really know him, but I've seen videos of the fights he made.
He was full of courage and stood for his beliefs, even if he was a bit too extremist.
CEtrainly someone that made an impact in the end of last century

 

[Jagger69]

Too young to really know him, but I've seen videos of the fights he made.
He was full of courage and stood for his beliefs, even if he was a bit too extremist.
CEtrainly someone that made an impact in the end of last century

Interesting. In what way was he extremist? Because he converted to Islam? Because he refused to fight in a war that was not only undeclared and illegal but about which he had deep conscientious and moral objections? In some other way perhaps? :dunno:

 

[Nick Beef]

He looked like Hell in the end. That Parkinsons is bad... RIP

 

[sean miguel]

What a crock of shit. It was showmanship, pure and simple. Ali was the greatest promoter boxing ever had. Considered a major sport in the 1950s, boxing had begun to wane in popularity with the emergence of Pro Football and the continued infatuation with MLB into the 1960s. Ali single-handedly brought the sport back to the forefront. Sure, he was cocky and brash and arrogant as a boxer....it was all a part of the schtick. His persona was what brought people back to boxing. After his retirement, it became obvious that he was truly a man of peace and generosity. Even though he suffered terribly from a grave disease on his own, he still had the compassion to give in both time and money to many worthwhile charities:

https://www.looktothestars.org/celebrity/muhammad-ali

If Ali was a "shitty" person as you claim, we should all be so "shitty". The world would be a much better place.

Showmanship. Except how he treated his fellow competitors (comparing Joe Frazier to a monkey, for instance) which he later said he regretted. So after his retirement he was truly a man of peace and generosity but not during his hey day (which is what I was referring to) including his Nation of Islam stint and his blatant anti-white, anti-jew statements. Ali is being venerated not for just his talent he showed in the ring but for the stances he took out of it. If that's the case, then the racist bile he's spewed shouldn't be glossed over.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...mp-ISN-T-racist-needs-sing-tolerant-tune.html

 

[sean miguel]

Interesting. In what way was he extremist? Because he converted to Islam? Because he refused to fight in a war that was not only undeclared and illegal but about which he had deep conscientious and moral objections? In some other way perhaps? :dunno:

In what way was he extremist? Not because he converted to Islam, but because it was the Nation of Islam he was a member of which is akin to the KKK. They're a black supremacist organization.

Surely, you know about this. Or was it just his schtick?


some of Ali's quotes:

"All Jews and gentiles are devils, Blacks are no devils. Everything black people doing wrong comes from (the white people): Drinking, smoking, prostitution, homosexuality, stealing, gambling. It all comes from (the white people)."

'‘Integration is wrong, we don’t want to live with the white man. I’m sure no intelligent white person in his or her right mind wants black men and women marrying their white sons and daughters and in return introducing their grandchildren to half brown, kinky haired people. I want to be with my own. No women on this whole earth can please me and cook for me and socialise and talk to me like an American black woman. You can’t take no Chinese man and give him no Puerto Rican woman and talking like they’re in love and emotionally in love and physically."

"A black man should be killed if he’s messing around with a white women, and if a black woman was messing with a white man? Then she dies. Kill her too."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...mp-ISN-T-racist-needs-sing-tolerant-tune.html

So yeah, the greatest boxer of all time but also a shitty human being at the time.

 

[Jagger69]

In what way was he extremist? Not because he converted to Islam, but because it was the Nation of Islam he was a member of which is akin to the KKK. They're a black supremacist organization.

Surely, you know about this. Or was it just his schtick?


some of Ali's quotes:

"All Jews and gentiles are devils, Blacks are no devils. Everything black people doing wrong comes from (the white people): Drinking, smoking, prostitution, homosexuality, stealing, gambling. It all comes from (the white people)."

'‘Integration is wrong, we don’t want to live with the white man. I’m sure no intelligent white person in his or her right mind wants black men and women marrying their white sons and daughters and in return introducing their grandchildren to half brown, kinky haired people. I want to be with my own. No women on this whole earth can please me and cook for me and socialise and talk to me like an American black woman. You can’t take no Chinese man and give him no Puerto Rican woman and talking like they’re in love and emotionally in love and physically."

"A black man should be killed if he’s messing around with a white women, and if a black woman was messing with a white man? Then she dies. Kill her too."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...mp-ISN-T-racist-needs-sing-tolerant-tune.html

So yeah, the greatest boxer of all time but also a shitty human being at the time.

Walk a mile in my shoes, brother. When he returned from the 1960 Olympics after winning the gold medal in boxing (representing the USA), he was denied service at a "whites only" lunch counter. Yeah he converted to Islam....so fucking what? He refused out of conscience to participate in an illegal and undeclared war, had his title stripped, lost his boxing license and a means of making a living for 3 years until the Supreme Court ruled in his favor. Yes, he was an angry young man. Can't say that I blame him. Back in the 1960s....a time with which you have zero direct experience by the way, there was extreme racial tension in this country in case you weren't aware. All you know is what you seek to find on the internet. I notice you conveniently left out this passage from your source, by the way.

But then Ali grew up, matured and in the process changed dramatically in his views and beliefs.

‘The man who views the world at 50 the same as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life,’ he memorably observed.

And Ali didn’t waste a day, morphing from angry firebrand activity to public advocate for global peace and harmony.

“Over the years my religion has changed and my spirituality has evolved,’ he latterly explained, ‘religion and spirituality are very different, but people often confuse the two. Some things cannot be taught, but they can be awakened in the heart. Spirituality is recognizing the divine light that is within us all. It doesn’t belong to any particular religion; it belongs to everyone. We all have the same God, we just serve him differently…It doesn’t matter whether you’re a Muslim, a Christian, or a Jew. When you believe in God, you should believe that all people are part of one family. If you love God, you can’t love only some of his children.”

So no, the greatest boxer of all time was not a "shitty" human being. He was a human being, complete with all its imperfections. Judge a man by the whole body of work of his life, not only by the learning experiences he had to endure in order to attain the wisdom to change. It is those who hate and make generalizations about whole groups of people, not only individuals, who are the true shitty human beings because they just keep on hating and never even attempt to change. That was the point of the article in fact....to urge your hero Donald Trump to take a cue from Ali. I guess you must have missed that part, huh?

 

[sean miguel]

Walk a mile in my shoes, brother. When he returned from the 1960 Olympics after winning the gold medal in boxing (representing the USA), he was denied service at a "whites only" lunch counter. Yeah he converted to Islam....so fucking what? He refused out of conscience to participate in an illegal and undeclared war, had his title stripped, lost his boxing license and a means of making a living for 3 years until the Supreme Court ruled in his favor. Yes, he was an angry young man. Can't say that I blame him. Back in the 1960s....a time with which you have zero direct experience by the way, there was extreme racial tension in this country in case you weren't aware. All you know is what you seek to find on the internet. I notice you conveniently left out this passage from your source, by the way.



So no, the greatest boxer of all time was not a "shitty" human being. He was a human being, complete with all its imperfections. Judge a man by the whole body of work of his life, not only by the learning experiences he had to endure in order to attain the wisdom to change. It is those who hate and make generalizations about whole groups of people, not only individuals, who are the true shitty human beings because they just keep on hating and never even attempt to change. That was the point of the article in fact....to urge your hero Donald Trump to take a cue from Ali. I guess you must have missed that part, huh?

My "hero" Donald Trump? You might not have been paying attention.

And you dismiss Ali's quotes as just those of an angry young man and that you don't blame him. And then praise him for his actions during that same time frame. And he converted to islam "so fucking what?" Did you not get the distinction between that and the Nation of Islam? Or is there no distinction?

Predictable.

While being "the greatest ever" he was a fucking self-obsessed racist. Excuse that all you want.

"A black man should be killed if he’s messing around with a white women, and if a black woman was messing with a white man? Then she dies. Kill her too."

 

[sean miguel]

Walk a mile in my shoes, brother.

And don't talk to me about that. I've experienced racism growing up and from within my own extended family. But I didn't hate white people. So in that regard, I'm better than Ali. He was fucking stupid. There's no way around that.

 

[sean miguel]

Being multi-racial, that's "offensive" to me. Where's my safe space?

He's a grown ass man saying those things but excusable according to some fucking white liberal patrician.

 

[LaurenPhillips]

I don't know what to say to the example of birds flying together. I would hope Ali understood that human beings are more evolved than birds. If he wanted an animals more on our level of intelligences, would you think of monkeys or dolphins?? At least Dolphins fuck for fun.

 

[sean miguel]

Being multi-racial, that's "offensive" to me. Where's my safe space?

He's a grown ass man saying those things but excusable according to some fucking white liberal patrician.

If a white sports legend had said the same thing even in his youth would he be given a pass? Another reason why I despise liberals.

 

[sean miguel]

Watching that video, one of the things I come away with is, I like Muhammad Ali and I understand his draw - he spoke his mind. He didn't give a shit and walked the walk.

I don't agree with him, but respect.

 

[Jagger69]

And don't talk to me about that. I've experienced racism growing up and from within my own extended family. But I didn't hate white people. So in that regard, I'm better than Ali. He was fucking stupid. There's no way around that.

Yeah well you didn't grow up black in the south in the 40s & 50s either so sorry but there's no comparison. "You're better than Ali"! Yeah, right. The fact that you call him "fucking stupid" is in itself all I need to know about your knowledge of him, his life and the changing times in which he lived. I don't condone the radical statements he made when he was young and angry and, fortunately, as he grew into maturity, neither did he. It takes a lot of courage for a man so visible as he was to admit he was wrong and decide to change, both privately and publicly. Donald Trump (and please accept my apologies for lumping you into being one of his bigoted supporters if that isn't the case. I made an assumption and we both know what that means) could learn a lot from Ali, just as the article states.

 

[sean miguel]

Yeah well you didn't grow up black in the south in the 40s & 50s either so sorry but there's no comparison. "You're better than Ali"! Yeah, right. The fact that you call him "fucking stupid" is in itself all I need to know about your knowledge of him, his life and the changing times in which he lived. I don't condone the radical statements he made when he was young and angry and, fortunately, as he grew into maturity, neither did he. It takes a lot of courage for a man so visible as he was to admit he was wrong and decide to change, both privately and publicly. Donald Trump (and please accept my apologies for lumping you into being one of his bigoted supporters if that isn't the case. I made an assumption and we both know what that means) could learn a lot from Ali, just as the article states.

Credit to him for changing but what he's being being revered for (for the most part) is when he was a young radical.

 

[zipper_666]

RIP Muhammad Ali