i think the gag factor guys have had some issues as well
Max Hardcore Saint or Sinner?
- Thread starter Ludovico
- Start date
i think the gag factor guys have had some issues as well
Skyraider22
The One and Only Big Daddy
I have not seen any of his work but the way you guys speak of him he sounds horrible.
Obscenity is a totally ridiculous and overly-broad concept. As much as I hate Max and those like him, nobody deserves to go to prison merely for offending someone. That's the gist of what obscenity is all about, after all -- offended sensibilities. People didn't like the content, so they want it to be censored, and the First Amendment be damned. It's stupid and it's unconstitutional; just look at the criteria (split up for clarity):
That said, I believe the government should have gone after Max (and others like him) for different reasons. First and foremost among those is taking advantage of women who quite possibly were not in their right minds due to mental illness (one example) and/or drugs. If those don't negate both consent and contracts, then something is seriously wrong.
That said, I believe the government should have gone after Max (and others like him) for different reasons. First and foremost among those is taking advantage of women who quite possibly were not in their right minds due to mental illness (one example) and/or drugs. If those don't negate both consent and contracts, then something is seriously wrong.
Will E Worm
Conspiracy...
Most movies, probably all movies can fall under those terms.
Next stop Hollywood. :yinyang:
Yes and no.
Certain acts in his scenes are illegal in the US, so they get cut before release. That was more or less the whole deal with this conviction. He apparently sent out the uncut European versions to customers in the US.
BTW, he was on that CNBC pr0n documentary last week. He seemed rather sullen really. I guess he had accepted his faith.
Rey C.
Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
To the rich man, I was a poor man. To the sinner, I was a saint.
Max's stuff doesn't do anything for me. But I'm not prepared to sit here and say whether he's a sinner or a saint. Maybe he's neither. :dunno:
The way I look at it, since I'm not into his material, I don't watch it. But as far as I know, he's not kidnapping anyone and forcing them to perform in his movies under duress or coercion. And he doesn't force anyone to buy his movies.
I think people have to start taking responsibility for themselves and stop wishing for the nanny state to protect them from everything that they (personally) don't care for. And more than anything, it boggles my mind when I hear someone say what porn should be. It should be this or it should be that. Says who? The morality of porn... on the next episode of Jerry Springer. I don't pay any attention to that kind of wishful thinking anymore than I do bible thumpers, who would lock up anyone who dared to so much as bare a breast in a photograph. To each his own. But if you don't like something, don't watch it!
Max's stuff doesn't do anything for me. But I'm not prepared to sit here and say whether he's a sinner or a saint. Maybe he's neither. :dunno:
The way I look at it, since I'm not into his material, I don't watch it. But as far as I know, he's not kidnapping anyone and forcing them to perform in his movies under duress or coercion. And he doesn't force anyone to buy his movies.
I think people have to start taking responsibility for themselves and stop wishing for the nanny state to protect them from everything that they (personally) don't care for. And more than anything, it boggles my mind when I hear someone say what porn should be. It should be this or it should be that. Says who? The morality of porn... on the next episode of Jerry Springer. I don't pay any attention to that kind of wishful thinking anymore than I do bible thumpers, who would lock up anyone who dared to so much as bare a breast in a photograph. To each his own. But if you don't like something, don't watch it!
Rey C.
Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
Sure. But how do you determine if that's what's going on? What I mean is, how blatant does it have to be to cross that line?
The reason I ask is because I can name quite a few sites (including some OCSM's here) that do schoolgirl fanatsies on their sites? So how do you draw that line, short of the (21 year old in pigtails) girl actually saying in a scene, "Hey Mr., you know I'm only 14, right?" *giggle giggle* :dunno:
I very strongly disagree. That kind of thinking is what has caused much hardcore porn to become the way it is today: extreme past the point of sanity and unsafe to the point of causing health problems for pornstars (mostly women). If the economy weren't in such a sad state, you can bet that the government damn well should be sending in the psychologists and medical doctors to straighten things up in the porn industry and remove the destructive individuals that simply don't belong in it.
I don't care what people do in their own bedrooms. However, hardcore porn is a public media, and a very popular one at that. Whether people like it or not, individuals of all ages are exposed to it*. It does affect a significant number of its viewers mentally*. It needs to be regulated. Harshly.
That doesn't fly with me either. Demand for some types of content does cause harm. Some things should not be ignored.
* http://board.freeones.com/showpost.php?p=2014489
Rey C.
Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
Blink, I really appreciate your candor. Clearly, we're polar opposites on the issue of free will and human self determination. It's not often that someone will admit that they are completely against those principles.
May I ask, what led you to this sort of thinking: that people cannot decide for themselves what is right for them? You seem to believe that there should be a nanny state, where government bureaucrats will decide what is right and wrong for individuals to watch, do, say, buy???
A gal-pal of mine likes the odd spanking from time to time. Sexy little wench, with her panties around her knees, I must say. But if we ever put our naughty antics on an amateur site (riiight... never happen!), will your Agency of Proper Porn seek us out and put us in jail... or me at least? I mean, might someone say that this is in violation of the Violence Against Women Act or something like that? Some deranged guy could watch our little 3 minute scene and decide that he's going to go snatch a random woman off the street, yank her skirt up and swat her on the fanny. Yeah, that absolutely could happen! I won't deny that. But would we (I) be responsible for that obvious act of inappropriate behavior and violence??? I'm guessing you might say yes, as you don't seem to believe, as I do, that each and every individual (short of some real and true mental incapacity) is morally, if not legally, responsible for his or her own actions.
In my world, you do it... you own it. In your world, you do it... well.... someone should be there to tell you what to do before you do it. Nothing bad that you do is ever truly your fault, I suppose?
No, I don't live that way. And I will never live that way! Some people perceive that we're already moving in that direction. While I think that might be the desire of some within the present administration, I do not see that that will ever truly happen here. I'm not tracking down birth certificates on the internet or tuning into Boss Rush Limbaugh everyday. But anyone who tells me that people should not be responsible for their own actions would never get my vote. And I would spend my last dollar and my last minute of free time to see that they did not occupy public office in my state. I don't mean no, I mean Hell no!
But tell me, how do you feel?
May I ask, what led you to this sort of thinking: that people cannot decide for themselves what is right for them? You seem to believe that there should be a nanny state, where government bureaucrats will decide what is right and wrong for individuals to watch, do, say, buy???
A gal-pal of mine likes the odd spanking from time to time. Sexy little wench, with her panties around her knees, I must say. But if we ever put our naughty antics on an amateur site (riiight... never happen!), will your Agency of Proper Porn seek us out and put us in jail... or me at least? I mean, might someone say that this is in violation of the Violence Against Women Act or something like that? Some deranged guy could watch our little 3 minute scene and decide that he's going to go snatch a random woman off the street, yank her skirt up and swat her on the fanny. Yeah, that absolutely could happen! I won't deny that. But would we (I) be responsible for that obvious act of inappropriate behavior and violence??? I'm guessing you might say yes, as you don't seem to believe, as I do, that each and every individual (short of some real and true mental incapacity) is morally, if not legally, responsible for his or her own actions.
In my world, you do it... you own it. In your world, you do it... well.... someone should be there to tell you what to do before you do it. Nothing bad that you do is ever truly your fault, I suppose?
No, I don't live that way. And I will never live that way! Some people perceive that we're already moving in that direction. While I think that might be the desire of some within the present administration, I do not see that that will ever truly happen here. I'm not tracking down birth certificates on the internet or tuning into Boss Rush Limbaugh everyday. But anyone who tells me that people should not be responsible for their own actions would never get my vote. And I would spend my last dollar and my last minute of free time to see that they did not occupy public office in my state. I don't mean no, I mean Hell no!
But tell me, how do you feel?
As I said, I don't care what people do in their own bedrooms. Your argument is not exactly relevant.
Anyway, as far as public media goes: anything that is being portrayed and sold for profit should be carefully scrutinized. The hardcore porn industry is not being looked at critically by those who should be doing so, and that is a problem.
No its not because its not the roll of the Govt to pre screen what I watch or read. With porn where do you draw the line? Is it film only? or what if I right a book? Will that be prohibited in your world also.
Freedom to chose is the argument at hand, Max Hardcore just happens to be the subject. Dont get caught up on him its not about him. This is about the individuals right to choose what is okay for him and not the Governments. What if the govt says, oh lets say bikini contest are degrading to women, is that okay because the govt said so? Censorship in any form is bad. If I don't want to see it or watch it, guess what I wont.
Rey C.
Racing is life... anything else is just waiting.
Why isn't my argument relevant? Do I strike you as the type of guy who does stuff for free? That 3 min scene would go on a clip site for $4.99, my friend. And if we made enough money on the first one, there would surely be a Part II. So, we'd be in "the business", no?
Tell me, who should be looking at porn? What criteria should they be using, yours? How about some Evangelical pastor? Maybe a delegation from N.O.W.? Who???
Alright, I can see that I was overly broad with what I said. Pertaining to porn only, its production involves real people performing risky activities, and ignorance about the risks is a problem in some cases. These days, I think that a significant percentage of the hardcore porn produced has become too extreme, in that people are being harmed physically and that people who may not be entirely in control of themselves (due to mind-altering drugs) and/or are mentally ill are performing in it. There is a hardcore porn industry, and just like any other industry, there are rules that it should abide by. I happen to think that the government is not currently doing enough to regulate the porn industry.
Censorship and obscenity prosecution seem to be motivated more by emotion, politics, and/or religion than by logic. That is why I want to see psychologists and medical doctors take a good look at what is happening within the hardcore porn industry. Obviously, the government would have to instigate something like that.
Perhaps one day soon we'll be able to make 100% computer-generated porn that doesn't involve real people taking risks to produce it. Then, I suppose, things would get a lot murkier regarding regulation. Extreme content would still be produced, but no one could argue that production of it would be harming anyone. Consumption might remain a problem for some people, but that would put porn into the same category as video games, Hollywood movies, and books.
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