Greatest Military Strategist?

[Johan]

Ṣalāḥ ad-Dīn Yūsuf bin Ayūb (a.k.a. Saladin)

 

[D-rock]

It's pretty much Hannibal vs. everybody else in this competition. Half of the very greatest military victories as far as strategy and wining against a superior force in history were lead by him.

I'm surprised Subutai never comes up in these kinds of things.

 

[knowone]

It's pretty much Hannibal vs. everybody else in this competition. Half of the very greatest military victories as far as strategy and wining against a superior force in history were lead by him.

Didn't quite cut it as far as exit strategy. Winning battles but not the war drops someone a lot in the greatest strategist list IMO.

 

[STDiva]

This is a great thread!! Thanks for the input, ya'll. I've been reading a lot about this garbage lately and I love it.

I'm going with Sun Tzu because he literally wrote the book on war strategy.

 

[tiger1977]

Alexander the Great

 

[Johan]

Also, has strategy and tactics been overcome by superior technology ?

I don't think so.

Right now, in Irak of Afghanistan, technology seems quite uneffective against one of the oldest and most basic strategy : guerilla (including but no only street guerilla)

 

[abrogate]

You can go through a process of elimination on some of them
Napolean, Lee, and Hannibal lost.
To steal a joke, after Sun Tzu wrote his book, China lost a bunch of wars.

What about Washington? Started a world war while he was young in his career and developed the "if you can't catch me, you can't destroy me" tactic.

Props to Jaeger re: Guderian. I agree. However, the RAF can't be underestimated in their part. Also, it wasn't just Goering convincing Hitler that the Luftwaffe could finish the British off. The armor needed to refit and be conserved for Case Red, the second phase of conquering France.

Operation Sea Lion was predicated on the fact that the Luftwaffe would destroy the RAF. That didn't happen any way.

Besides, Hitler had his heart set on Operation Barbarossa, which was the real end of him.

Just a little icing on the cake was the attack on Pearl Harbor. Hitler was looking for the US to be tied up in the Pacific and off of his back. I guess he didn't plan on Roosevelt's "Europe First" strategy. Oops.

 

[Straight Shooter]

Osama Bin Ladin. With only 19 soldiers he bankrupted the west.

I never thought about him that way. You Might have a point there

 

[Little Red Wagon Repairman]

Genghis Khan
Josef Stalin

 

[Ace Boobtoucher]

Josef Stalin? Really? The man murdered 20 million of his own people in a global pissing contest. If anything it was the shitty Russian weather which defeated the Nazis. Okay, his massive disregard for human life was a contributing factor but the man was no military genius.

At least Cap'n Crunch won the hearts and minds of millions of children.

 

[MetalMan77]

Colonel Lingus.

 

[Rey C.]

Robert E. Lee? A guy who got his ass kicked and then had to hand over his sword, does NOT make my list of "greatest strategists". Not even... :nono: In ancient times, he likely would have been killed or made a slave for dishonoring himself by surrendering.

Julius Caesar, by a long shot, although there are some other good choices on the list.

But Caesar's "siege within a siege" at the Battle of Alesia was a remarkable bit of strategy and tactics. And what can you say about a man who repels a larger invading force, pursues them, builds an elaborately engineered bridge across the Rhine, defeats the shocked enemy forces on the other side, returns back across the Rhine... and tears down the bridge? :dunno: That's a bad mofo, right there! In the time Caesar was in Gaul, he had roughly four legions at his command at any given time (20K-22K men, give or take). And according to various historians, he engaged as many as three million enemy combatants during the Gallic Wars. But Caesar, and the early Romans, believed in the concept of total war (brutal, yet effective): it's estimated that of the three million who engaged Caesar's forces, one million enemy soldiers died, another one million were enslaved and 800 cities were destroyed. If you didn't surrender and propose instant "friendship" (gold, slaves, land, whatever you happen to have laying around), you tended to die a quick ... or a slow death at the hands of the Romans.

And it's interesting that a more modern general (also a fan of Julius Caesar's strategies and tactics) brought back the concept of "total war" and cemented himself as a great general, while also dealing with some pesky rebels: William Tecumseh Sherman. "I'm only going to say this once. If I have to repeat myself, how about I burn your town, kill your livestock and stick a bayonet up your wife's ass? So uh... can you hear me now?!"
Yep, ol' Willie T. Sherman "went Roman" on their southern fried asses. :1orglaugh

But still... Gaius Julius Caesar FTW! :2 cents:

 

[Smallville22]

Alexander The Great

 

[Ace Boobtoucher]

Ariel Sharon, Moshe Dayan and Yitzhak Rabin did a pretty good job of kicking the ass of the coalition of Arab states a few times.

 

[Jagger69]

re: Guderian. I agree. However, the RAF can't be underestimated in their part. Also, it wasn't just Goering convincing Hitler that the Luftwaffe could finish the British off. The armor needed to refit and be conserved for Case Red, the second phase of conquering France.

Operation Sea Lion was predicated on the fact that the Luftwaffe would destroy the RAF. That didn't happen any way.

Besides, Hitler had his heart set on Operation Barbarossa, which was the real end of him.

Just a little icing on the cake was the attack on Pearl Harbor. Hitler was looking for the US to be tied up in the Pacific and off of his back. I guess he didn't plan on Roosevelt's "Europe First" strategy. Oops.

All true. Furthermore, had England been knocked out of the war (337,000 potential prisoners of war from the BEF were evacuated and lived to fight another day....many on the beaches of Normandy 4 years later), Case Red could have been finished at Hitler's convenience and he then could have turned his full attention to Russia. No way was the US prepared in any form to join the fray in the summer of 1940. However, again Hitler made a tremendous blunder by once again allowing Goering to convince him of the Luftwaffe's capability to bring England to her knees without a seaborne invasion being needed. Who knows what would have happened had Hitler followed up with a full-scale invasion of the UK and been able to avoid a 2-front war. Anyway....he didn't and the rest is history....fucker got what was coming to him. :thumbsup:

 

[Red XXX]

If you mention Red Cloud, you must also mention Tatanka Yotanka, Crazy Horse, Ten Bears and perhaps the greatest of all, Chief Joseph.

Yes, you have a point ;-) Similarly if you mention say Drake, then likewise men like Frobisher, Hawkins and Winter should also be included. After all a general is no one with no one to command.

 

[Baill Inneraora]

He does not even deserve a spot on the poll. He may not have started Gettysburg, but when he got there, choose to continue a battle against a superior force who held the high ground, and did so with little intelligence on enemy troops. If he had been up against a great Union General (instead of an average one) the war would have ended there.

Did the same thing at Malvern Hill.

Longstreet and Jackson made him look good.

 

[Sam Fisher]

He does not even deserve a spot on the poll. He may not have started Gettysburg, but when he got there, choose to continue a battle against a superior force who held the high ground, and did so with little intelligence on enemy troops. If he had been up against a great Union General (instead of an average one) the war would have ended there.

I and many others disagree with your assertion.

Robert E. Lee On Leadership:
Executive Lessons in Character, Courage, and Vision
by H.W. Crooker III

Robert E. Lee was a leader for the ages. The man heralded by Winston Churchill as “one of the noblest Americans who ever lived” inspired an out-manned, out-gunned army to achieve greatness on the battlefield. He was a brilliant strategist and a man of unyielding courage who, in the face of insurmountable odds, nearly changed forever the course of history.

In this remarkable book, you'll learn the keys to Lee's greatness as a man and as a leader. You'll find a general whose standards for personal excellence were second to none, whose leadership was founded on the highest moral principles, and whose character was made of steel. You'll see how he remade a rag-tag bunch of men into one of the most impressive fighting forces history has ever known. You'll also discover other sides of Lee—the businessman who inherited the debt-ridden Arlington plantation and streamlined its operations, the teacher who took a backwater college and made it into a prestigious university, and the motivator who inspired those he led to achieve more than they ever dreamed possible. Each chapter concludes with the extraordinary lessons learned, which can be applied not only to your professional life, but to your private life as well.

Today's business world requires leaders of uncommon excellence who can outsmart the competition and overcome the cold brutality of constant change. Robert E. Lee was such a leader. He triumphed over challenges people in business face every day. Guided by his magnificent example, so can you.

 

[winterwarz]

I would go with Sun Tzu for strategic leadership and on the field leadership strategy I would choose either Alexander the Great or Ghengis Khan.

 

[L3ggy]

Isildur, son of Elendil

Just for cutting off a finger from The Black Hand? Besides it was Elendil and Ereinion Gil-Galad that marshalled those armies.