New Cassini views of Saturn
- Thread starter AFA
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What an appropriately funded mission can do ... and reminiscing ...
You see, Galileo, Cassini -- man, those were the great days!
I barely caught the end of them in my time with those bungling bunch of moronic engineers as most people believe today.
I was part of the "better, faster, cheaper" generation where quality assurance was cut 10x over with everything else.
Sigh, if only ... nope, we don't need to spend $17B on various NASA projects -- we could use that to build ... well ... a few houses here and there after administrative overhead.
Cassini has been a success well beyond anything anyone imagined.
Between Galileo and Cassini, we learned so much far beyond the Voyager probes.
Cassini's continued exploration is just a testament to how projects should be run at NASA.
Man, it's funny to look back at those past 18 years, all that was accomplished for both pure and applied science.
It all starts 18 years ago ...
I was in high school in Orlando and 1 man against a mob of about 50 protesters.
"Stupid football jock!" "Earth hater!" "You want us to glow blue" and even "War monger!"
You see, I made the wrongful decision to be a person who walked out and decided to disagree with the protesters of the Galileo launch at my high school.
The protesters were none-too-happy, especially when started using chalk on the sidewalk to describe how different nuclear reactions work, including the natural state of an RTG such as on Galileo, and how solar panels or fuel cells were useless for space probes.
Some 10 years ago ...
I did not have the luxury of doing the same, as I would have been fired from my employer immediately.
I was tempted to call the local radio station, but I limited myself to calming my grandmother's fears as she worried that she would be poisoned if the Titan IV exploded mid-launch.
In fact, I told her about how there had been not only several mid-launch explosions with RTGs aboard the very destroyed spacecraft in each and every case, but they dropped into the ocean as one, huge, solid chunk and were safely retrieved intact -- let alone reused later by NASA.
Since then NASA has had to make due with no money, no budget for QA and various "political" constraints, especially for Mars.
It didn't shock me one bit when it was discovered that two registers in the Mars Polar Lander were using different units of measure.
After all, when you cut QA, little things like integration -- let alone integration tests -- are the first things to go.
Galileo and Cassini are how NASA should be remembered, spending lots of money to do the job right, not giving a shit what the public thought, getting the job done, for all our collective benefit.
In the spirit of making thread a tangent of political reflection, I will offer my own, selfish response here.
You see, Galileo, Cassini -- man, those were the great days!
I barely caught the end of them in my time with those bungling bunch of moronic engineers as most people believe today.
I was part of the "better, faster, cheaper" generation where quality assurance was cut 10x over with everything else.
Sigh, if only ... nope, we don't need to spend $17B on various NASA projects -- we could use that to build ... well ... a few houses here and there after administrative overhead.
Cassini has been a success well beyond anything anyone imagined.
Between Galileo and Cassini, we learned so much far beyond the Voyager probes.
Cassini's continued exploration is just a testament to how projects should be run at NASA.
Man, it's funny to look back at those past 18 years, all that was accomplished for both pure and applied science.
It all starts 18 years ago ...
I was in high school in Orlando and 1 man against a mob of about 50 protesters.
"Stupid football jock!" "Earth hater!" "You want us to glow blue" and even "War monger!"
You see, I made the wrongful decision to be a person who walked out and decided to disagree with the protesters of the Galileo launch at my high school.
The protesters were none-too-happy, especially when started using chalk on the sidewalk to describe how different nuclear reactions work, including the natural state of an RTG such as on Galileo, and how solar panels or fuel cells were useless for space probes.
Some 10 years ago ...
I did not have the luxury of doing the same, as I would have been fired from my employer immediately.
I was tempted to call the local radio station, but I limited myself to calming my grandmother's fears as she worried that she would be poisoned if the Titan IV exploded mid-launch.
In fact, I told her about how there had been not only several mid-launch explosions with RTGs aboard the very destroyed spacecraft in each and every case, but they dropped into the ocean as one, huge, solid chunk and were safely retrieved intact -- let alone reused later by NASA.
Since then NASA has had to make due with no money, no budget for QA and various "political" constraints, especially for Mars.
It didn't shock me one bit when it was discovered that two registers in the Mars Polar Lander were using different units of measure.
After all, when you cut QA, little things like integration -- let alone integration tests -- are the first things to go.
Galileo and Cassini are how NASA should be remembered, spending lots of money to do the job right, not giving a shit what the public thought, getting the job done, for all our collective benefit.
Re: What an appropriately funded mission can do ... and reminiscing ...
As you’re a huge fan of free market capitalism, I'm sure you can appreciate the irony of it all. When I make similar arguments as to why so many businesses and government angecies are screwed up and why cutting corners to maximize profit and cutting cost to a ridiculous amount should never come above what is ethical and right for humanity I'm usually called a socialist by the hard-core free market people.
In the spirit of making thread a tangent of political reflection, I will offer my own, selfish response here.
You see, Galileo, Cassini -- man, those were the great days!
I barely caught the end of them in my time with those bungling bunch of moronic engineers as most people believe today.
I was part of the "better, faster, cheaper" generation where quality assurance was cut 10x over with everything else.
Sigh, if only ... nope, we don't need to spend $17B on various NASA projects -- we could use that to build ... well ... a few houses here and there after administrative overhead.
...Since then NASA has had to make due with no money, no budget for QA and various "political" constraints, especially for Mars.
It didn't shock me one bit when it was discovered that two registers in the Mars Polar Lander were using different units of measure.
After all, when you cut QA, little things like integration -- let alone integration tests -- are the first things to go.
Galileo and Cassini are how NASA should be remembered, spending lots of money to do the job right, not giving a shit what the public thought, getting the job done, for all our collective benefit.
As you’re a huge fan of free market capitalism, I'm sure you can appreciate the irony of it all. When I make similar arguments as to why so many businesses and government angecies are screwed up and why cutting corners to maximize profit and cutting cost to a ridiculous amount should never come above what is ethical and right for humanity I'm usually called a socialist by the hard-core free market people.
Unfortunately, pure science funding is rare outside of government ...
People think NASA gets a lot of money, until I start going over the federal budget with them.
And I made far more money once I left NASA, because engineers work there not because of the pay.
Secondly, NASA is one of those agencies that can't be well-replicated by private industry.
No commercial company would ever spend any significant money on pure science, only applied science and (more likely) engineering.
As an engineer, I have to admit this, even though I've caught myself having views even against spending money on pure science (even NASA) versus applied science or engineering projects.
It's one of the things I loved about the book and (to a lesser extent) movie Contact, and the great brilliance of Sagan at showing things never often considered by people outside NASA, the NSF, etc...
Ironically, we continue to get indirect applied science and engineering benefit from pure science, even if we don't see it decades down the road.
Remember, while I'm an American Libertarian, I'm not anti-government, anti-regulation, anti-socialism, etc...
I just think 90% of what we have today is quite unnecessary and removes individual freedoms.
Businesses are free to run their businesses as they see fit.
And American businesses are finding out first hand what some of their clossal fuck-ups in the '90s are costing them.
That had nothing to do with Clinton or W., but American businesses themselves.
Especially us engineers going, "we can't keep chucking out these gas guzzlers, skipping the R&D and expect the consumers to always guy them."
American businesses run by business people only see 3 years ahead.
American businesses run by engineers see 30 years ahead -- Xerox and Digital are gone, with only HP left (and not well).
Guess who runs the major Japanese businesses, such as the "six sisters"?
American engineering principles invented 50 years ago, still -- by far -- appreciated and implemented so much better by the Japanese "six sisters."
First off, the problem is that NASA is pretty bone dry.
People think NASA gets a lot of money, until I start going over the federal budget with them.
And I made far more money once I left NASA, because engineers work there not because of the pay.
Secondly, NASA is one of those agencies that can't be well-replicated by private industry.
No commercial company would ever spend any significant money on pure science, only applied science and (more likely) engineering.
As an engineer, I have to admit this, even though I've caught myself having views even against spending money on pure science (even NASA) versus applied science or engineering projects.
It's one of the things I loved about the book and (to a lesser extent) movie Contact, and the great brilliance of Sagan at showing things never often considered by people outside NASA, the NSF, etc...
Ironically, we continue to get indirect applied science and engineering benefit from pure science, even if we don't see it decades down the road.
Remember, while I'm an American Libertarian, I'm not anti-government, anti-regulation, anti-socialism, etc...
I just think 90% of what we have today is quite unnecessary and removes individual freedoms.
Businesses are free to run their businesses as they see fit.
And American businesses are finding out first hand what some of their clossal fuck-ups in the '90s are costing them.
That had nothing to do with Clinton or W., but American businesses themselves.
Especially us engineers going, "we can't keep chucking out these gas guzzlers, skipping the R&D and expect the consumers to always guy them."
American businesses run by business people only see 3 years ahead.
American businesses run by engineers see 30 years ahead -- Xerox and Digital are gone, with only HP left (and not well).
Guess who runs the major Japanese businesses, such as the "six sisters"?
American engineering principles invented 50 years ago, still -- by far -- appreciated and implemented so much better by the Japanese "six sisters."
Discovery Channel DVDs ...
You can find several Nova and other titles in the lot, often for a good discount on-line.
There are also some great, very extensive (i.e., 10-20+ hour) NASA sets that are relatively inexpensive.
The Discovery Channel regularly has its various DVD series products on-sale.
You can find several Nova and other titles in the lot, often for a good discount on-line.
There are also some great, very extensive (i.e., 10-20+ hour) NASA sets that are relatively inexpensive.
Re: Discovery Channel DVDs ...
Thanks much Prof. Will definitely check those out.
Did you ever see the PBS production of "Neptune All Night"?
Thanks much Prof. Will definitely check those out.
Did you ever see the PBS production of "Neptune All Night"?
Also check out The Science Channel on Sunday afternoons from about 3:00 p.m. unti 7:00 p.m. Some pretty good solar system/space shows.
I think my favorite is Nova on PBS.
Lately a lot by Neil deGrasse Tyson, a physisist;
http://research.amnh.org/~tyson/
Lately a lot by Neil deGrasse Tyson, a physisist;
http://research.amnh.org/~tyson/
I have friends at the JPL ...
I have seen a crapload more from NASA than what you see on PBS or in any other outlet.
All unedited, some even before they even knew what they were looking at.
Although nothing beats some of the missile defense stuff the military doesn't put out.
Now that stuff rocks, especially comparisons between the pre-hit-to-kill systems to today's hit-to-kill.
I've had friends at the JPL since the mid-'90s.
I have seen a crapload more from NASA than what you see on PBS or in any other outlet.
All unedited, some even before they even knew what they were looking at.
Although nothing beats some of the missile defense stuff the military doesn't put out.
Now that stuff rocks, especially comparisons between the pre-hit-to-kill systems to today's hit-to-kill.
Nova DVDs from Discovery Channel
Virtually every aerospace engineering team has one physicist, and he's the smartest man (or woman) in the room.
It's even better when you have one as a Colonel in charge of a military project, because he's all about the facts ma'm.
Anyhoo, here are all the Nova DVDs at the Discovery Channel for sale:
http://shopping.search.discovery.com/Discovery/?Ntt=nova
I just got the Origins video set (for half that price during one of their sales), but haven't had the chance to watch it yet.
People who get their PhDs in physics (let alone even just a BS) are some of the smartest people you will ever meet.
Virtually every aerospace engineering team has one physicist, and he's the smartest man (or woman) in the room.
It's even better when you have one as a Colonel in charge of a military project, because he's all about the facts ma'm.
Anyhoo, here are all the Nova DVDs at the Discovery Channel for sale:
http://shopping.search.discovery.com/Discovery/?Ntt=nova
I just got the Origins video set (for half that price during one of their sales), but haven't had the chance to watch it yet.
Re: I have friends at the JPL ...
Yes. That's what "NAN" was like.
It was remarkable being a witness to actual moments of discovery on such a grand scale.
The flyby of Triton was particularly interesting in that respect.
Thank you all for the links.
Yes. That's what "NAN" was like.
It was remarkable being a witness to actual moments of discovery on such a grand scale.
The flyby of Triton was particularly interesting in that respect.
Thank you all for the links.
Luxman
#TRE45ON
Cassini is scheduled to plunge into Saturns atmosphere tomorrow, Friday September 15th, 2017 at about 6:32am EDT.
NASA will stream video during Cassini's death plunge — and you can watch it live on YouTube
http://www.businessinsider.com/cassini-grand-finale-video-nasa-youtube-ustream-2017-9
Cassini spacecraft to end its mission tomorrow with a 70,000mph death plunge into Saturn's atmosphere
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/...-end-mission-death-plunge-saturns-atmosphere/
Bumping a 10 year old thread.
NASA will stream video during Cassini's death plunge — and you can watch it live on YouTube
http://www.businessinsider.com/cassini-grand-finale-video-nasa-youtube-ustream-2017-9
Cassini spacecraft to end its mission tomorrow with a 70,000mph death plunge into Saturn's atmosphere
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/...-end-mission-death-plunge-saturns-atmosphere/
Bumping a 10 year old thread.
Supafly
Retired Mod
That went down a little different, as some video footage that NASA just leaked hintzs at...
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