JRPG hate thread

[Torre82]

I have to post here. Because this forum is semi-dead and us oldsters dont flame anybody for having an opinion. (unlike gamefaqs, IGN or... anywhere. At all.)
ersion of a predetermined 'thing'?! I never even used Fire1 !!! HOW AM I GETTING FIRE 2?!

Ahem, now the reason I take issue with games, in this instance JRPGs... is that they have some great feature that should be integrated into the genre, as a whole.

I call it a 1/3 issue ~ a third of the thing is fine. The other thirds, which we shall refer to as TURDS.. (AVGN homage, plz) are holding back the good stinker, up front.

Great story? Shit gameplay. (Any final fantasy, depending on your likes/dislikes)
Great gameplay? Shitty system/mechanics. (Final Fantasy's old habit of trying something new every game, regardless of how AMAZEBALLS the previous system worked)
Great everything? The console you plan it on is shit and the developers didnt quality-test the thing, its buggy and crashes. CONSTANTLY. (Skyrim, fuck you!)
Great gameplay? Forces you to grind 40 hours into a system in which you have no idea what is coming, and you cant cover all your bases by going ice/fire/lightning/earth, because each will be weak and you should've specialized... or this or that, etc. (Etrian Odyssey, where there was a game that gave you the option to specialize in lightning and ONLY 2 ENEMIES IN THE GAME HAD A WEAKNESS TO IT!)

p.s. what is with the bullshit spell names in Persona?! Agi, Dia, Bufu... ugh, grow up.
Final Fantasy games.. why does cure heal and heal cures?
Grinding? Only AZNs have that much time to spend grinding weeks for every shitty, anime-style game. End the madness, Japan.

 

[FreeOnes_Adam]

When I discovered RPGs, there was no term called JRPGs, so I'm still confused on what that is exactly. Off the top of my head..

RPGs I grew up liking:

Dragon Warrior 1 (but several other sequels that I can't keep straight, 1 is my favourite for sure though) - NES
Final Fantasy - NES
Pokemon Red - Gameboy
Defenders of Oasis - Game Gear
Final Fantasy 6 - SNES
Secret of Mana - SNES
Super Mario RPG - SNES
Chrono Trigger - SNES
Quest 64 - N64
Mother 3 - GBA
Final Fantasy 5 - PS 1
Final Fantasy 7 - PS 1
Final Fantasy 8 - PS1 (although I'm embarrassed by that now)

Thing I like that I don't really call RPGs but some people do:

Legend of Zelda - NES
Adventure of Link - NES
Links Awakening - Gamboy
Zelda Windwaker - Gamecube
Zelda Breath of the Wild - Wii U
Red Red Redemption 2 - PS4
Witcher 3 - PS4


Playing right now:
Secret of Evermore - SNES

I have to say, Final Fantasy started moving in a weird direction since 9. People like 9, I never got into it. I finished it but it wasn't the FF I loved. I played 10 til the last dude, then I quit. Didn't much like it. Everything since has been too... anime-y. I don't like the art direction. Dudes are too feminine and you're talking to a guy who likes girls with dicks. I haven't really played anything proper turned based that has rivaled the NES/SNES years for me. Most RPGs that come out are either not RPGs to me (Zelda, Witcher), or are just too anime heavy for my tastes.

 

[freeones_regina]

When I discovered RPGs, there was no term called JRPGs, so I'm still confused on what that is exactly.

JAPANESE role playing games, tssss Adam

 

[tvstrip]

Skyrim is a JRPG?

 

[D-rock]

There are a lot of awesome JRPGs it's just most of them are from decades ago. At some point the western RPGs took over, and either from lack of ability to adapt or hideboundness of the people in Japan who made them and didn't want to admit they could learn something from the new RPGs coming out they got overtaken. It didn't help that when video games started to get the tech to move past 2d sprites JRPGs tried to put effeminate teenage characters as the protagonist in damn near all of the games for a time and quit using mature well thought out storytelling.

 

[darkwarrior3007]

Skyrim is a JRPG?

No. It is an RPG though. Same as The Witcher, which is classified as an Action-RPG, Adam. RDR2 is not an RPG.

I don't really hate JRPG's although that last one I played was FF 13, which I thought was okay. I do wish Sony would bring back The Legend of Dragoon. The last few Western RPG's I played were Deus Ex: Mankind Divided, Skyrim, The Witcher 3 and Mass Effect: Andromeda.

 

[tvstrip]

No. It is an RPG though. Same as The Witcher, which is classified as an Action-RPG, Adam. RDR2 is not an RPG.

I don't really hate JRPG's although that last one I played was FF 13, which I thought was okay. I do wish Sony would bring back The Legend of Dragoon. The last few Western RPG's I played were Deus Ex: Mankind Divided, Skyrim, The Witcher 3 and Mass Effect: Andromeda.

I was just saying that b/c T82 seemed to be confusing/bundling up non-JRPGs with Western ones. If he's displeased with skyrim, it's not a "JRPG" issue.

I think a big factor is if you're an old school gamer, or at least gravitated to JRPGs when you first got into the RPG genre. Most major RPGs from the NES/SNES era were JRPGs; if you grew up on Dragon Quest or Final Fantasy and enjoyed them, you're going to generally be happy with the JRPGs of today.

I'll quickly add that comment about asians being the only ones who have time to grind is just racist bullshit. That alone makes me feel that the issues isn't just about JRPGs.

 

[FreeOnes_Adam]

JAPANESE role playing games, tssss Adam

Like.. what isn't Japanese in origin? Seem like its easier to list what's NOT a JRPG.

 

[FreeOnes_Adam]

RDR2 is not an RPG.

I agree. But it's not all that much different than The Witcher 3.

 

[darkwarrior3007]

I agree. But it's not all that much different than The Witcher 3.

Nah, I gotta disagree with you on that.

 

[Torre82]

I was initially hating on JRPGs, then one rant leads to another.. and I like the direction of western rpgs. Generally.

Adam: Yeah, the grindy stuff really got to me, the other day. :\

Asian gaming racism?: Absolutely. Coming from a place of gaming in America, where our games are badly translated, not localized, censored or given features that 'do not translate' in terms of functionality, I will absolutely agree to my dislike of dealing with leftover asian influences on the games brought over here. Like streetpass ~ in Japan, I'm sure I could have found another system every 2 minutes if I brought my system to school. In the states, it can be hard to find another person with the same system. Furthermore the same games. I'm within my rights to complain about a society that spends more money, far more time than we do on their gaming.

China spends.(1)
Singapore spends.(2)
Asia spends time.(3)
Asians spend money.(4)

Numbers are one side of it.
Base fact that Nintendo, Sony and Sega drove the market since the beginning and our western efforts (Atari, Microsofx) havent been supremly successful.(1)

I dunno, man. I'm just saying they have a society set up to cater to them. More gamers, more acceptance, they are in the cradle of gaming civilization over there and we get their runoff.
Is it really racist to say they spend more time, when they do? I'm jealous of them, sure.
Do I need to go into how little I make, how many hours I've worked and how much I have to spend to keep my head above water and how little time or money I can spend on my pursuits? Economy is a sidenote. Important, though.
I'd love to have friends and neighbors, girlfriends and acquaintances who share more gamey interests. Its just my opinion, anywho. Didnt mean to offend.

 

[Supafly]

I will be as frank as possible - my initial reaction was, "Who hates on JPGs?"

I don't really understand what you guys talk about here. It has to do with role playing games and different nationalities, that much I understand (I guess)

But it all does not matter to me.

I still live in the generation of people trying to get that gorilla to stop throwing barrels down on me

 

[Torre82]

I will be as frank as possible - my initial reaction was, "Who hates on JPGs?"

I don't really understand what you guys talk about here. It has to do with role playing games and different nationalities, that much I understand (I guess)

But it all does not matter to me.

I still live in the generation of people trying to get that gorilla to stop throwing barrels down on me

Remember seeing those dorks who sit in their basements afterschool, rolling dice and talking about dungeons? And dragons?
Somewhere along the way, sometime took the hard work out of it. No more rolling dice, thats done behind the scenes.
But we cant just save ourselves all the work and skip to the good parts.. I say! Leroy, let us program in some fluff! You know, some fluff ~ some filler! To make up for all the time we've saved, we have to pad this thing so that it lasts HOURS longer!
Every so often force a harder fight. And give them a cliche, somewhat generic story.

I cant be certain, but I believe that the conversation went along those lines. Why make every moment entertaining, when you can make arbitrary rules about getting stronger?
I mean, I could make a comparison to capitalism, too.
"Work 10 hours a week to make rent? BUT WHAT ABOUT ALL THAT FREE TIME?! No, no.. pay them less and charge them more. To stretch the whole thing out, furtherish! Write that down, Leroy. Thats important.


And yeah, we grew up on those. I recently figured that since I'm not finding what I need, I might as well play something at least 'accomodating' to me. I might've found just that ~ I picked up xenoblade chronicles and I'm digging it.
To quote the review:
..the game does away with random battles, those irritating, repetitive fixtures of series like Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest. In their place is a more action-oriented system, where you can actually see your enemies out in the field, and you can choose to either attack or avoid them. When you do engage in battle, much of the monotony has been streamlined: characters will perform their basic attacks automatically..
By taking the boring basic combat out of your control, Xenoblade actually makes things more challenging... Meanwhile, when you're just grinding for experience against weaker foes, the action can largely be automated, which is a whole lot more enjoyable than constantly mashing the attack button. Essentially, Xenoblade lets you ignore the boring bits... so it's easy to just pick up and do a bit of exploration or level grinding while taking the train to work. Unlike many RPGs, every play session doesn't have to last a few hours. ...at any point you can hit a button to get a reminder of what exactly is happening in the story at that moment (perfect for when you get sidetracked taking on extra quests). Over the years I’ve found it increasingly challenging to play the kinds of JRPGs I grew up with, because they require such a massive time investment, but Xenoblade is a game I can play whether I have 10 minutes or a few hours to spare.

When I constantly got 4 different things tugging at my attention, its nice to just flip the screen closed and come back to it later. I cant put in 10 hour marathon sessions every day like those things USUALLY demand.
Me and my friends watch a few series, play a few games.. just a few. When a TV show or a game starts feeling like 'work', we drop it. We want that 'JUST ANOTHER TEN MINUTES HOLD ON' feeling from everything. The game has to be fun, not just the 'grind'. Going up that hill to mine the crystal up top has to feel like an adventure every time. Which means gearing up and planning and the whole damned system has to feel streamlined. Natural. And important. It has to feel hard but not cheap.

As opposed to those other games, for a younger or more devoted demographic.

/wall of text

 

[FreeOnes_Adam]

Nah, I gotta disagree with you on that.

That's fine. That's just my personal opinion. Like I said, I grew up with the traditional NES and SNES rpgs, so games like RDD2 and Witcher 3 just don't add up to an RPG in my mind. They are both what I call exploring-and-walking-around games. I like those types of games. Those are my favourite modern games. That's why I'm liking Horizon Zero Dawn. Kinda. I'm taking a break to play Secret of Evermore on SNES

 

[Torre82]

That's fine. That's just my personal opinion. Like I said, I grew up with the traditional NES and SNES rpgs, so games like RDD2 and Witcher 3 just don't add up to an RPG in my mind. They are both what I call exploring-and-walking-around games. I like those types of games. Those are my favourite modern games. That's why I'm liking Horizon Zero Dawn. Kinda. I'm taking a break to play Secret of Evermore on SNES

Liked soe, minus the ingredient hunting. (at least in certain eras.) tell fire eyes i said hello.

 

[FreeOnes_Adam]

Liked soe, minus the ingredient hunting. (at least in certain eras.) tell fire eyes i said hello.

Legit just got off my bike and thought of Fire Eyes. I have a red motorcycle

 

[Torre82]

Legit just got off my bike and thought of Fire Eyes. I have a red motorcycle

First time playing? Replaying?
What'd you think of secret of mana? (The original, not that 2017 remake.)

 

[FreeOnes_Adam]

First time playing? Replaying?
What'd you think of secret of mana? (The original, not that 2017 remake.)

I played it completed it many moons ago. Long enough to not remember much of it.

I have played Secret of Mana many times. I own it. I know the game well. I really adore it. I think I also played the remake, but the SNES version is of course the best.

 

[Torre82]

When it came out after SoM, I half expected more of the same. A lot of people, naturally, felt like.. oh hell yeah, a squeakuel! I read in one of those gamer magazines that it was made by the crew in America, and I had a hard-on for those japper games at that time, so I went in biased against it.
:\ Looking back, now.. I like the whole cheesy nostalgia aspect, and having a few decades to compare it to other square games.. hell yeah its one of the better ones. Even kinda funny, isnt it?

Secret of Mana was kind of my tutorial into the whole RPG arena. Someone bought me final fantasy 1 when I was 7. It was above my paygrade and I returned it. (le sigh, kind of a wasted opp) Its just such a crazy combination of greatness. The game isnt too hard, too easy, the multiplayer aspect, the art style, the time period, jeezy creezy its just so unexpectedly awesome.
I played through it, last year. Then tried to play evermore but I couldnt take another grand rpg. Too burnt out kicking rabite and mushroom asses.

Uber sadness, tho = trying to find another game like it!
The groundwork was laid, decades have passed. Still. Nothing like those secret-of games. Well, not technically true.. you ever play through Seiken Densetsu 3? Its secret of mana 3, and its been translated for decades, too. Give it a go if you want more of the same, but .. it kinda doesnt have the magic.

 

[D-rock]

It's weird, but one of the things I remember most from the Secret of Mana is the boss fight music for Thanatos. One of the best boss fights themes from that era IMO. The Secret of Mana has a lot of great things I remember, and has an all around excellent soundtrack, but that just stuck out so much for me back then because it's just so different from all the other music in the game. Most of the other songs had nice similar melodies and were gentile and soothing. Some of them had a nice spooky atmosphere where appropriate, that song on the other hand was suddenly so chaotic and dark to my younger mind that I knew crap was about to go down. It was at the very end of the game so the only way you could hear it before songs were on the internet was to get there, and it wasn't like the final fortress is easy to do quickly.