Fucked Over

[Harley Spencer]

Alright guys, I have a story for you. It's a rather long one.

I'll start with what's happening right now. The photographer that I work with for the majority of my site's photographic content pointed out a facebook page of someone pretending to be me. Here's the link:

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100003210164559

What's more, we know these people. I know who it is because they've posted numerous links to their own website, and I've worked with them before. Now, to go back in time for a minute...

Their names are Tom and Marci. In November of 2010, they contacted me through a modeling website that I network on with interest in collaborating. After traveling to NJ in December, I signed some papers and we agreed on $500 for solo shoots and $750 for g/g shoots. The next day, we shot at a custom bike shop, where I worked with one other model, did some solo stuff, and worked with 2 different photographers. That was a test shoot, for which I was to be paid $750. At the end of shoot, they didn't pay me because they said "if" they used the photos, they'd pay.

So I went back to work with them a second time a few months later. Pre-shoot, it was discussed that we would be shooting with the other model the first night I was there, and just solo work the second 2 days. That didn't happen. We shot with the other model the first 2 days, and if it weren't for the photographer taking me back to his apartment the next day, I wouldn't have gotten anything solo done.

I didn't get paid for these shoots either.

Tom told me repeatedly that he was basically building up a tab with me. First he told me he'd have me the money by the end of February, 2011. Nope. Then he told me he'd have me the money by summer. Nope. What month is it now? February. What year? 2012.

After not getting paid, I sent him an email saying that I would no longer work with him until he could afford to pay me what he owes me. After going back over my papers that I signed with them, I noticed a catch. It said that they would pay me the money "IF" they used it for their paid site, www.hotshoterotica.com.

Now. They never launched that website. Instead, they launched a different website. www.fashionerotica.com. Instead, they're using my photos on there. However, about a month ago, I typed www.hotshoterotica.com into my web browser and it came up with a zenfolio website (automatically redirected). It's free to sign up, but apparently, they have merchandise within the website for sale. They have a number of photos of my on the homepage.

I also noticed in one of the papers that there was no "IF" anywhere in regards to the test shoot. It was to be $750 flat, no ifs, ands, or buts.

These guys completely screwed me over, as well as a bunch of other girls. At least 15 other girls that I know of. They con all these girls into working with them for free, promising them money without any intent on actually paying them, and they do the same to photographers, designers, and photo retouchers. For example, one girl was promised $10 per retouched photo. She retouched hundreds. How much did they pay her? $100. They've gotten girls drunk and blamed the photographers for the shitty photos. They've created multiple accounts on ModelMayhem, using other photographers' work of me and other models, claiming to be the photographers themselves.

They've tried to contact me several times since I told them I would no longer work with them. They've done the little small talk, i.e. how have things been, what have you been up to, yadda yadda yadda. They've also mentioned to me in one email a few months ago that they decided to make me their spokes-model and asked if I would be interested in trading promotional content for our websites. A few weeks ago, they contacted the owner of my website, asking him if I would be interested in shooting TF* (trade for photos) with them. Fat chance!

I've been extremely pissed off about this throughout the entire ordeal. Now today when I came across their impersonation of me, I became even more pissed off. It's one thing to not pay me and screw over an ass ton of other people in the process, but to drag this out for over a year is beyond ridiculous.

I'm fed up. These guys wanna play games and be immature and fuck with my life? Alright. I would be willing to play... but it's not a game. This is life. Bring it on, assholes. I am now dedicated to completely slandering them, throwing out their names and websites, and ruining their reputation. And, hopefully, either getting the money I'm owed or getting them into a whole lot of trouble for the bullshit they've pulled. And of course, I'm hoping that any other girls out there who might read this will steer clear of them if they are ever contacted by them, because they will now know that they are complete fakes and will do nothing but harm.

 

[Deepcover]

You should sue their asses. Nobody likes to get fucked around especially when hard earned money is on the table. Hope someone out there will catch the slimy hustlers. The only good thing that came of this story is, now you will know how to handle a business proposition reasonably better with more intelligence so you won't get yourself screwed over next time. It sucks when shit like that happens. You live and you learn.

 

[Harley Spencer]

You should sue their asses. Nobody likes to get fucked around especially when hard earned money is on the table. Hope someone out there will catch the slimy hustlers. The only good thing that came of this story is, now you will know how to handle a business proposition reasonably better with more intelligence so you won't get yourself screwed over next time. It sucks when shit like that happens. You live and you learn.

I've never sued anyone before. Or attempted it. Or even took anyone to court. Though I imagine I could probably take this to small claims court.

You're right, I know better now. I need to make sure I read the releases, agreements, and contracts prior to shooting. Usually I just skim over them.

 

[PirateKing]

When I read the thread title I thought "why would she be mad about that?", but then I realized you were being metaphorical.

But yeah, you should use whatever resources you have to spread a bad reputation about them and their site. That's the best approach IMO. Hit em hard. Metaphorically.

 

[gunslingingbird]

I'm no law expert, but if you have a signed contract where they agree to pay for the work you did for them, then you should be able to take them to court. If your wages were lost or delayed, as seems to be the case, you can also file a grievance with the labor board. According to the labor board, an employer has 30 days to compensate you for any work done. If after 30 days they haven't paid you the labor board will demand that the employer pay the full amount, plus a penalty of 100% of the money they owe you for every day it's delayed, without exceeding a total of 30 days' penalty. If I were you I would look into legal steps instead of slander because then they could end up suing you for defamation.

 

[jlm555]

The same thing happened to Denise Milani. I hope you Kick some ass Harley!

 

[darkwarrior3007]

I'm no law expert, but if you have a signed contract where they agree to pay for the work you did for them, then you should be able to take them to court. If your wages were lost or delayed, as seems to be the case, you can also file a grievance with the labor board. According to the labor board, an employer has 30 days to compensate you for any work done. If after 30 days they haven't paid you the labor board will demand that the employer pay the full amount, plus a penalty of 100% of the money they owe you for every day it's delayed, without exceeding a total of 30 days' penalty. If I were you I would look into legal steps instead of slander because then they could end up suing you for defamation.

I agree with this. I know you said that you never sued anyone before, I'd take the contract to a lawyer and go over your case. Find out what type of case you can bring to court and go through with it. Like Gun said, all slandering is gonna do is open you up for a lawsuit.

 

[zorgmorg]

have a attorney that is familiar with these type of contracts send a demand letter to the other party stating A, B, C, etc.
since they have already used your images to gain revenue you should simply demand the fees paid originally agreed upon
getting them to pay attorney's fees too would reqire a court if I'm not mistaken and that usually costs 1000s in attorney fees.

 

[Roald]

I've never sued anyone before. Or attempted it. Or even took anyone to court. Though I imagine I could probably take this to small claims court.

You're right, I know better now. I need to make sure I read the releases, agreements, and contracts prior to shooting. Usually I just skim over them.

Most girls i've had the pleasure working with at consumer shows just skim over contracts. So yes always read what you sign.

Good luck with it!

 

[bobjustbob]

If modeling is your profession then you need to read the fine print. You don't do work unless you get paid. Your time is valuable. If they want to look at you without taking pictures then that is an interview. No pay for that. If they want pictures then bring them your portfolio to look at. No pictures during an interview.

Harley I love you. Being 21 and stupid is not a bad thing. We have all been there. To go out and take legal actions will cost you more than the time and money you are worth. Put it behind you as a mistake that you will learn from. If those scum bags want to print your pictures it will be more images of you out there to showcase your talent.

Keep that contract and read it over a few times. Think about that fine print. Many more people will be showing up at your door looking for you. If they have paperwork that you need to look over then take a day to read it over. If they are legit and they like you enough then they won't mind the extra day. As I said before, no pay no work.

 

[~~whimsy~~]

Always read every little word in a contract before you sign; always have every contract looked over by a lawyer who specializes in contracts; always check into people and/or companies, studios, etc. etc. that seems too good to be true.

And get second opinions if you feel you need. BEFORE YOU SIGN ANYTHING!

Lesson has been given. Hope you don't make same mistake twice.

 

[squallumz]

fagbook. i blame fagbook.

 

[Supafly]

If you have any sort of written agreement with them, sue. I have experience as a lay judge, and your chance of getting your money are really good.

Another advice I have given another OCSM around FreeOnes is:

I remember a Fats Domino concert way back. The audience had to wait for 45 minutes because he insisted of being paid up front in cash. They had to go to the local Deutsche Bank and get the money.

He just made too many gigs without getting paid afterwards so he changed his policy.

So you might go and do like Fats, insist on cash up front. If the people you deal with are honest, they should pay, otherway I guess something's shady.

 

[larss]

Looks like the FB page has been taken down, so you may be getting through.
If what guns says is true, then you should be able to sue for at least $750 plus 30 days at $750 which makes a total of $23250

 

[monicasilver]

Ouch! I'm sorry to hear that.

I was talking into doing a shoot with a photographer a couple of years ago. Like an idiot I signed the release, but was told that if I wasn't happy with the pictures we would just redo them. I wasn't happy with them. I've seen them posted on the Internet. It wasn't in the release, so there is really nothing for me to do about it other than learn from my mistake.

I think people are good overall, but there are some that just don't care.

Alright guys, I have a story for you. It's a rather long one.

I'll start with what's happening right now. The photographer that I work with for the majority of my site's photographic content pointed out a facebook page of someone pretending to be me. Here's the link:

https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100003210164559

Ouch! I'm sorry to hear that.

I was talking into doing a shoot with a photographer a couple of years ago. Like an idiot I signed the release, but was told that if I wasn't happy with the pictures we would just redo them. I wasn't happy with them. I've seen them posted on the Internet. It wasn't in the release, so there is really nothing for me to do about it other than learn from my mistake.

I think people are good overall, but there are some that just don't care.

What's more, we know these people. I know who it is because they've posted numerous links to their own website, and I've worked with them before. Now, to go back in time for a minute...

Their names are Tom and Marci. In November of 2010, they contacted me through a modeling website that I network on with interest in collaborating. After traveling to NJ in December, I signed some papers and we agreed on $500 for solo shoots and $750 for g/g shoots. The next day, we shot at a custom bike shop, where I worked with one other model, did some solo stuff, and worked with 2 different photographers. That was a test shoot, for which I was to be paid $750. At the end of shoot, they didn't pay me because they said "if" they used the photos, they'd pay.

So I went back to work with them a second time a few months later. Pre-shoot, it was discussed that we would be shooting with the other model the first night I was there, and just solo work the second 2 days. That didn't happen. We shot with the other model the first 2 days, and if it weren't for the photographer taking me back to his apartment the next day, I wouldn't have gotten anything solo done.

I didn't get paid for these shoots either.

Tom told me repeatedly that he was basically building up a tab with me. First he told me he'd have me the money by the end of February, 2011. Nope. Then he told me he'd have me the money by summer. Nope. What month is it now? February. What year? 2012.

After not getting paid, I sent him an email saying that I would no longer work with him until he could afford to pay me what he owes me. After going back over my papers that I signed with them, I noticed a catch. It said that they would pay me the money "IF" they used it for their paid site, www.hotshoterotica.com.

Now. They never launched that website. Instead, they launched a different website. www.fashionerotica.com. Instead, they're using my photos on there. However, about a month ago, I typed www.hotshoterotica.com into my web browser and it came up with a zenfolio website (automatically redirected). It's free to sign up, but apparently, they have merchandise within the website for sale. They have a number of photos of my on the homepage.

I also noticed in one of the papers that there was no "IF" anywhere in regards to the test shoot. It was to be $750 flat, no ifs, ands, or buts.

These guys completely screwed me over, as well as a bunch of other girls. At least 15 other girls that I know of. They con all these girls into working with them for free, promising them money without any intent on actually paying them, and they do the same to photographers, designers, and photo retouchers. For example, one girl was promised $10 per retouched photo. She retouched hundreds. How much did they pay her? $100. They've gotten girls drunk and blamed the photographers for the shitty photos. They've created multiple accounts on ModelMayhem, using other photographers' work of me and other models, claiming to be the photographers themselves.

They've tried to contact me several times since I told them I would no longer work with them. They've done the little small talk, i.e. how have things been, what have you been up to, yadda yadda yadda. They've also mentioned to me in one email a few months ago that they decided to make me their spokes-model and asked if I would be interested in trading promotional content for our websites. A few weeks ago, they contacted the owner of my website, asking him if I would be interested in shooting TF* (trade for photos) with them. Fat chance!

I've been extremely pissed off about this throughout the entire ordeal. Now today when I came across their impersonation of me, I became even more pissed off. It's one thing to not pay me and screw over an ass ton of other people in the process, but to drag this out for over a year is beyond ridiculous.

I'm fed up. These guys wanna play games and be immature and fuck with my life? Alright. I would be willing to play... but it's not a game. This is life. Bring it on, assholes. I am now dedicated to completely slandering them, throwing out their names and websites, and ruining their reputation. And, hopefully, either getting the money I'm owed or getting them into a whole lot of trouble for the bullshit they've pulled. And of course, I'm hoping that any other girls out there who might read this will steer clear of them if they are ever contacted by them, because they will now know that they are complete fakes and will do nothing but harm.

 

[xfire]

Don't wait too long to take legal action or you'll run into a statute of limitations and won't be able to recover.

 

[Roald]

If you have any sort of written agreement with them, sue. I have experience as a lay judge, and your chance of getting your money are really good.

Another advice I have given another OCSM around FreeOnes is:

I remember a Fats Domino concert way back. The audience had to wait for 45 minutes because he insisted of being paid up front in cash. They had to go to the local Deutsche Bank and get the money.

He just made too many gigs without getting paid afterwards so he changed his policy.

So you might go and do like Fats, insist on cash up front. If the people you deal with are honest, they should pay, otherway I guess something's shady.

I would never pay 100% up front. Too many flakey models.

 

[Jack Davenport]

Without seeing the documents there may be cause for a complaint but you made the task much more difficult being your own agent. You will have to decide whether it is worth the added expense in pursuing this. Depending on the amount you are seeking and what relief you asking for. I am going to assume that you signed these documents without having them witnessed and notarized. Sometimes a simple letter from an attorney will get their attention informing then to cease and desist.

if this is your main source of income I would at least try to halt any further posting of your photos by these people but it seems like you will have to retain legal counsel to accomplish this. Also these people seem like stiffs and may not have any assets to even be able recover a judgment if you were granted one. On the face of it, you will probably have to travel to NJ again to file any action. Ultimately to resolve this you are going to have to spend some money or accept that they pulled one over on you. Anything that is important enough to sign as a contract is also important enough to have a legal professional review before you sign it. It's either pay now or pay later.


Best of luck.

 

[Harley Spencer]

If modeling is your profession then you need to read the fine print. You don't do work unless you get paid. Your time is valuable. If they want to look at you without taking pictures then that is an interview. No pay for that. If they want pictures then bring them your portfolio to look at. No pictures during an interview.

Harley I love you. Being 21 and stupid is not a bad thing. We have all been there. To go out and take legal actions will cost you more than the time and money you are worth. Put it behind you as a mistake that you will learn from. If those scum bags want to print your pictures it will be more images of you out there to showcase your talent.

Keep that contract and read it over a few times. Think about that fine print. Many more people will be showing up at your door looking for you. If they have paperwork that you need to look over then take a day to read it over. If they are legit and they like you enough then they won't mind the extra day. As I said before, no pay no work.

You're saying I'm 21 and stupid? Awesome. Thanks. Dude, making mistakes from time to time doesn't mean I'm stupid.

I'm not worth time and money? Great, that's awesome too, thanks.

Here's the thing. I don't want them to post my photos anywhere, for whatever purpose, period. The facebook page that they created pretending to be me wasn't the name Harley Spencer, they made a new name, Brigitte De Leon, and used my photos. That's not bringing me more fans, that's using me and my likeness for personal gain, in a douchebag way.

I don't want them to use my photos, even if it's for promotional purposes and would bring me more fans or members. I hate them. I've never been so screwed over in my life. I'm more concerned about my sanity, well-being, morality, and happiness than I am about any of that material, superficial BS.

 

[Harley Spencer]

If modeling is your profession then you need to read the fine print. You don't do work unless you get paid. Your time is valuable. If they want to look at you without taking pictures then that is an interview. No pay for that. If they want pictures then bring them your portfolio to look at. No pictures during an interview.

Harley I love you. Being 21 and stupid is not a bad thing. We have all been there. To go out and take legal actions will cost you more than the time and money you are worth. Put it behind you as a mistake that you will learn from. If those scum bags want to print your pictures it will be more images of you out there to showcase your talent.

Keep that contract and read it over a few times. Think about that fine print. Many more people will be showing up at your door looking for you. If they have paperwork that you need to look over then take a day to read it over. If they are legit and they like you enough then they won't mind the extra day. As I said before, no pay no work.

Sorry, I know you have good intentions with what you said. I was being a little ridiculous when I first read it!