Petra
Cult Mother and Simpering Cunt
Well, if you get pain killers + booze I'm sure you'll be in a right merry state.
dungeons and dragons (D&D) anyone?
Well, if you get pain killers + booze I'm sure you'll be in a right merry state.
squallumz
knows petras secret: she farted.
george!
also, last night, i ran my parents first game. remember i got them minis for christmas?
it was pretty fun. i got some music this time for the game, found d&d soundtrack and it was pretty good actually.
used my new vinyl chessex mat, my new dice. it was great. that mat is awesome, btw. just wipes off. lays flat.
they picked it up pretty good. sometimes my mom thought she was the DM and once she tried to walk up to a white dragon and heal it as it was pinned down by some icicles. pfft. that thing was pissed. she shoulda got her ass bitten. luckily, my sister told her she was insane and that there was no chance they could beat a dragon at first level and they had a chance to escape and find the real enemy of the game.
at the end, they found him and his apprentice. the dark wizard consumed his soul and broke the curse i placed on the wizard (my dad). and executioner (my mom), got to finally kill the escaped condemned. thanks to a critical hit on my dads daily wizard spell.
what a perfect way to end, with a daily crit. fire everywhere!
also, last night, i ran my parents first game. remember i got them minis for christmas?
it was pretty fun. i got some music this time for the game, found d&d soundtrack and it was pretty good actually.
used my new vinyl chessex mat, my new dice. it was great. that mat is awesome, btw. just wipes off. lays flat.
they picked it up pretty good. sometimes my mom thought she was the DM and once she tried to walk up to a white dragon and heal it as it was pinned down by some icicles. pfft. that thing was pissed. she shoulda got her ass bitten. luckily, my sister told her she was insane and that there was no chance they could beat a dragon at first level and they had a chance to escape and find the real enemy of the game.
at the end, they found him and his apprentice. the dark wizard consumed his soul and broke the curse i placed on the wizard (my dad). and executioner (my mom), got to finally kill the escaped condemned. thanks to a critical hit on my dads daily wizard spell.
what a perfect way to end, with a daily crit. fire everywhere!
Petra
Cult Mother and Simpering Cunt
That sounds pretty cool. Enjoy getting new people into the game? Have you tried anything else out? You should try traveller perhaps, I haven't played it but there is a pocket guide which has been on my wish list for around a year now. I just don't have much spare cash lying around to pay for things, hence only being able to afford pretty dice 
But Dark Conspiracy III might be released soon, its in the pipeworks. Unfortunately, or fortunately depending which angle you look at it, I have a life, and you know at the moment been decorating my flat, I also have a pretty low income. But not much point in spending lots of cash on D&D if you haven't got players. So I can see how you got your family roped into it, and glad your sister enjoys it. There are other good games, you might enjoy a game called 'Talisman'. Of course if you end up having nobody to play, its always a good idea to invest in either drawing, writing your own stories and books or adventures, and painting minis, or creating minis. This is part is pretty enjoyable for me, I play 1 or 2 games of D&D a week, and really wished we explored a few other systems, my old club was much larger and there were usually 3-4 DMs at one moment, not including the other rpg group in the other room. But yeah I am rattling on, but just wanted to say its cool you enjoy table top rpgs so much!
But Dark Conspiracy III might be released soon, its in the pipeworks. Unfortunately, or fortunately depending which angle you look at it, I have a life, and you know at the moment been decorating my flat, I also have a pretty low income. But not much point in spending lots of cash on D&D if you haven't got players. So I can see how you got your family roped into it, and glad your sister enjoys it. There are other good games, you might enjoy a game called 'Talisman'. Of course if you end up having nobody to play, its always a good idea to invest in either drawing, writing your own stories and books or adventures, and painting minis, or creating minis. This is part is pretty enjoyable for me, I play 1 or 2 games of D&D a week, and really wished we explored a few other systems, my old club was much larger and there were usually 3-4 DMs at one moment, not including the other rpg group in the other room. But yeah I am rattling on, but just wanted to say its cool you enjoy table top rpgs so much!
squallumz
knows petras secret: she farted.
regarding other games/systems, im just keeping it simple right now. we are all still learning and playing d&d 4e and, even though there are some games like wonderland no more and serenity/firefly, and even maybe shadowrun, that really appeal to me, i dont want to get my gaming all confused.
im having fun with 4e a lot, just want to focus on one game at a time. i know there are tons more tabletop rpgs out there that i would love but im one of those one game at a time people.
im having fun with 4e a lot, just want to focus on one game at a time. i know there are tons more tabletop rpgs out there that i would love but im one of those one game at a time people.
Petra
Cult Mother and Simpering Cunt
Get confused? What? Like my constantly asking for notice rolls in Vampire when I should be asking for alertness + perception? Or spot rolls? ;-)
I can understand if your pissed because you spent a lot of money on books. I know my DM did, not sure how pissed he is tho'
Petra you ninja . Yeah I was about to say what Petra said. 5ed (dont quote me) will be released for 2013. But if you sign up to wizards of the coast you can partake in 5ed playtests, and give your say in what you would like to see them create. They are trying to make it fan driven.
NY TIMES ARTICLE
OFFICIAL WIZARDS OF THE COAST COVERAGE
D&D CROSSWORD OF SLAYING +5
Awwww c'mon Squall, you have to see it as a step in a new direction, the right direction
I added the link to the crossword just for fun.
Petra you ninja . Yeah I was about to say what Petra said. 5ed (dont quote me) will be released for 2013. But if you sign up to wizards of the coast you can partake in 5ed playtests, and give your say in what you would like to see them create. They are trying to make it fan driven.
NY TIMES ARTICLE
OFFICIAL WIZARDS OF THE COAST COVERAGE
D&D CROSSWORD OF SLAYING +5
Awwww c'mon Squall, you have to see it as a step in a new direction, the right direction
I added the link to the crossword just for fun.
I think they realized they screwed up when they went to 4th edition. There have always been spits in the fan base but it was like nothing before when that happened. I have a feeling they will try to get a lot of the old fans of earlier editions back, probably with only moderate success at most.
THEY DIDNT SCREW UP WHEN THEY WENT TO 4TH !!!! ARGHGHGH *BARBARIAN RAGE* There are much simpler reasons for the fan base split. Generation, allowance for games, and just talk. But hell, if you really do think so then Ill accept that. Just dont say again!
ps. we are not even going to have this "edition war" discussion. kay?
ps. we are not even going to have this "edition war" discussion. kay?
squallumz
knows petras secret: she farted.
I can understand if your pissed because you spent a lot of money on books. I know my DM did, not sure how pissed he is tho'
Petra you ninja . Yeah I was about to say what Petra said. 5ed (dont quote me) will be released for 2013. But if you sign up to wizards of the coast you can partake in 5ed playtests, and give your say in what you would like to see them create. They are trying to make it fan driven.
NY TIMES ARTICLE
OFFICIAL WIZARDS OF THE COAST COVERAGE
D&D CROSSWORD OF SLAYING +5
Awwww c'mon Squall, you have to see it as a step in a new direction, the right direction
I added the link to the crossword just for fun.
*sigh* i sucked ass at the crossword. sucked. ass.
Petra
Cult Mother and Simpering Cunt
THEY DIDNT SCREW UP WHEN THEY WENT TO 4TH !!!! ARGHGHGH *BARBARIAN RAGE* There are much simpler reasons for the fan base split. Generation, allowance for games, and just talk. But hell, if you really do think so then Ill accept that. Just dont say again!
ps. we are not even going to have this "edition war" discussion. kay?
They did screw up.
It wasn't that they released a new edition that did it for a lot of people. It was they totally disregarded what their players wanted and they took classes and races people like, CLASSIC fantasy RPG classes and races, out of the first release of the PHB. Instead, they promised to release it again later in another book. This was seen as a money grab instead of a marketing strategy that fans welcomed.
On top of that, 4th is heavily revolved around THEIR maps and THEIR mini's that they try to get you to buy seperately in order to run adventures and of course you need to sign up to their subscription based site to get further products.
I know what Wizards is/was doing, but gamers are a finicky bunch and this wasn't the way to market to them.
In laymans terms perhaps you could argue this. But in laymans you can also argue that you get every single edition, every single book ever made of D&D for free via pdf.
As a roleplayer though. I think D&D insider is a great investment (for $9 a month), it covers Dragon and Dungeon magazine, it has pre-made adventures, it has a character generator, a full monster and treasure compendium, it has world-wide access to 5ed playtest, it has a free lively forum. Plus plenty of articles to get you ingrossed into Forgotten Realms.
The creation of essentials, was mainly for the use in D&D Encounters, where we signed up with our local comic shop and Wizards of the Coast sent us two free copies of 'Beyond the crystal cave' inclduing free double sided maps, tokens, pre-generated character on high quality card stock, and a full advenutre. Plus two free copies Lair Assault 'Talon of Umberlee'
Beyond the crystal cave sells on ebay for £130
The previous Lair Assault called 'Forge of the Dawn Titan' sells on ebay for £60
The Essentials handbook is only needed for playing Encounters, and for the 6 weeks I have been playing. I have not used my rules compendium once, it costs me £10. One of the most expensive items I have purchased so far is my miniature which was from Reaper.
The far most expensive cost is for the DM, when he or she wants to purchase minis, extra tiles, or maps. And I got to say it can get expensive at this point. But then so is amounting a 1000pt Space Marine Chapter for Warhammer 40k. If it wasnt for my DM then I doubt I would have played so much D&D in the last year. But he wanted to collect, he had the money to purchase products, and without me playing then he would have had one less character to try and kill. In the year we met and played. My DM went from.
Click Image to Enlarge Adult Image Hosting
to this...
Click Image to Enlarge Adult Image Hosting
And dont get me wrong I loved 2nd Edition, Larry Elmores work was amazing, some of the rules were awesome, the activity of running long campaigns purely created from a guys head and his love for graph paper was fascinating. That doesnt mean any of that isnt possible in 4ed. It purely is, about roleplaying, if your DM allows you to explore story after story, with decisions being made with the outcome of a die roll, then I love it!
I would love to hear players reasons why 3.5 edition was so much more awesome than 4ed. Because when I purchased my copy of the 3.5 players handbook, leather bound et al. I just starred blankly at the awful art, and rules that just looked simular to 2nd edition, and wondered how the hell I would find anyone in their right mind who would sit down and play with me. 4ed is accessible! Anyone can play! And its simple to join in on a game if a local store plays Encounters.
As a roleplayer though. I think D&D insider is a great investment (for $9 a month), it covers Dragon and Dungeon magazine, it has pre-made adventures, it has a character generator, a full monster and treasure compendium, it has world-wide access to 5ed playtest, it has a free lively forum. Plus plenty of articles to get you ingrossed into Forgotten Realms.
The creation of essentials, was mainly for the use in D&D Encounters, where we signed up with our local comic shop and Wizards of the Coast sent us two free copies of 'Beyond the crystal cave' inclduing free double sided maps, tokens, pre-generated character on high quality card stock, and a full advenutre. Plus two free copies Lair Assault 'Talon of Umberlee'
Beyond the crystal cave sells on ebay for £130
The previous Lair Assault called 'Forge of the Dawn Titan' sells on ebay for £60
The Essentials handbook is only needed for playing Encounters, and for the 6 weeks I have been playing. I have not used my rules compendium once, it costs me £10. One of the most expensive items I have purchased so far is my miniature which was from Reaper.
The far most expensive cost is for the DM, when he or she wants to purchase minis, extra tiles, or maps. And I got to say it can get expensive at this point. But then so is amounting a 1000pt Space Marine Chapter for Warhammer 40k. If it wasnt for my DM then I doubt I would have played so much D&D in the last year. But he wanted to collect, he had the money to purchase products, and without me playing then he would have had one less character to try and kill. In the year we met and played. My DM went from.
Click Image to Enlarge Adult Image Hostingto this...
Click Image to Enlarge Adult Image HostingAnd dont get me wrong I loved 2nd Edition, Larry Elmores work was amazing, some of the rules were awesome, the activity of running long campaigns purely created from a guys head and his love for graph paper was fascinating. That doesnt mean any of that isnt possible in 4ed. It purely is, about roleplaying, if your DM allows you to explore story after story, with decisions being made with the outcome of a die roll, then I love it!
I would love to hear players reasons why 3.5 edition was so much more awesome than 4ed. Because when I purchased my copy of the 3.5 players handbook, leather bound et al. I just starred blankly at the awful art, and rules that just looked simular to 2nd edition, and wondered how the hell I would find anyone in their right mind who would sit down and play with me. 4ed is accessible! Anyone can play! And its simple to join in on a game if a local store plays Encounters.
Petra
Cult Mother and Simpering Cunt
Again, from a marketing perspective, what Wizards did with their D&D brand is expected of any company. They re-invented themselves and added a whole bunch of shiney new extras that will attract a different kind of player. I don't know if you've ever played any MMO's, but I played Everquest pretty much since it was released and that's what 4e feels like. It took the mechanics of today's most popular MMO and put it on paper.
To me, both a DM and player, this changed the entire feel of D&D. The few times I played 4e now, it feels more like a video game than a rpg because it really gears you towards combat (hence the battle maps, mini's, etc). You're 100% right that it's up to the DM to make it the type of game he/she wants to pay but I can tell you that for myself, if I'm going to have to pay for the books/rules and then re-invent the wheel in order to gear my game towards a more role playing oriented campaign, I'm not going to drop that kind of money on it.
Not only that, but in general role-players are the poor as church mouse types. I have actually worked in the RPG publishing industry for a bit and I know how hard it is to get a role-player to actually buy your book. You alienate them and piss them off, the chance they're going to give your product another chance is almost nil.
So that goes back to the fact that Wizards disregarded people's wishes for 4e in a lot of ways, dropping a lot of core fantasy elements that D&D is known for, and they lost paying customers. Not that my opinion counts for shit, but they should have left the core fantasy elements alone and worked on improving the mechanics instead of making a whole new system. Then, if they wanted to drop bards, monks or whatever, they could have produced another fantasy realm like Ebberon or Forgotten Realms.
To me, both a DM and player, this changed the entire feel of D&D. The few times I played 4e now, it feels more like a video game than a rpg because it really gears you towards combat (hence the battle maps, mini's, etc). You're 100% right that it's up to the DM to make it the type of game he/she wants to pay but I can tell you that for myself, if I'm going to have to pay for the books/rules and then re-invent the wheel in order to gear my game towards a more role playing oriented campaign, I'm not going to drop that kind of money on it.
Not only that, but in general role-players are the poor as church mouse types. I have actually worked in the RPG publishing industry for a bit and I know how hard it is to get a role-player to actually buy your book. You alienate them and piss them off, the chance they're going to give your product another chance is almost nil.
So that goes back to the fact that Wizards disregarded people's wishes for 4e in a lot of ways, dropping a lot of core fantasy elements that D&D is known for, and they lost paying customers. Not that my opinion counts for shit, but they should have left the core fantasy elements alone and worked on improving the mechanics instead of making a whole new system. Then, if they wanted to drop bards, monks or whatever, they could have produced another fantasy realm like Ebberon or Forgotten Realms.
squallumz
knows petras secret: she farted.
too late. it has begun!
you know my feelings on 4th. it was the first edition i ever played. ive spent the last year learning it, playing it, dming it. i love it.
anything i dont like about something, i change it.
the change only effects the people who knew the old game. and now that 5e is coming out, im already upset. im gonna be playing an old version.
and that is the problem with 4e. its new. and that will be the problem with 5e.
i say, make it all old school looking and they win. make it new and itll be a failure.
THEY DIDNT SCREW UP WHEN THEY WENT TO 4TH !!!! ARGHGHGH *BARBARIAN RAGE* There are much simpler reasons for the fan base split. Generation, allowance for games, and just talk. But hell, if you really do think so then Ill accept that. Just dont say again!
ps. we are not even going to have this "edition war" discussion. kay?
No offense, and I mean this as somebody that has no problems with anybody that likes and plays 4th edition, (Even if I have soured on Wizards the company that produces it.) but even the brass for D&D knows they really really screwed up. That is why they are trying to back peddle so quickly and do damage control. I have a hard time believing it's just coincidence they are going to 5th edition now and have been trying to get back in touch with the people that have moved on for months now after they are starting to lose the grip on the industry they once had. A few years ago it was nearly laughable that some other RPG would come close to challenging D&D for the top spot, and yet it happened because of the spit in the fan base that couldn't take the direction it was going unlike any before it. What probably happened is they thought, "Hey we're D&D. We have the name recognition and the market share. No matter what they do they won't leave us because we're D&D." Let people did. Even when other editions came out I never saw so many people claim "it wasn't D&D" as they did with 4th. That's why Pathfinder has become equal and maybe even pulled ahead of it. It became "more D&D" and all that came to mean over the decades than D&D itself was at that point.
Petra
Cult Mother and Simpering Cunt
Just like Apple, Wizards are always going to have the D&D fan boys that live and breath D&D. Nothing Wizards does will tarnish the reputation of D&D in the eyes of these guys. They will pick up every book and every mini, map, and anything else they can buy. Balls for them.
I'm a Vampire the Masquerade fangirl. So if you want to talk about a game with plenty of haters, you can talk about that one. But guess what? White Wolf did pretty much exactly what Wizards did. They decided to close up shop on the most popular edition and cash cow they had and scrap it for a brand new system. They fucked with the stuff that Masquerade players LOVE. That did nothing to endear us to the new system and new lore.
Is the new system crap? Actually no. It's a lot less faff, it's quicker. But it never really took off because they couldn't convince their current market to pick it up.
Once again I'll say it...marketing to role-players is like no other market out there. It's a very small and exclusive market, even with the mainstream attention it's been getting. We're choosey buggers but loyal. Trying to convince us of new ideas is hard. Want to look at a company that really fucked up? Look at White Wolf and their choice to ditch the setting everyone knows and loves (so much that the MMO that's being made is in the Masquerade setting, not the new one). You're not a very successful as a RPG publisher if you can't sell product...sure, there's WhiteWolf fan boys and they kept the company in business but not as successful as before imo.
I'm a Vampire the Masquerade fangirl. So if you want to talk about a game with plenty of haters, you can talk about that one. But guess what? White Wolf did pretty much exactly what Wizards did. They decided to close up shop on the most popular edition and cash cow they had and scrap it for a brand new system. They fucked with the stuff that Masquerade players LOVE. That did nothing to endear us to the new system and new lore.
Is the new system crap? Actually no. It's a lot less faff, it's quicker. But it never really took off because they couldn't convince their current market to pick it up.
Once again I'll say it...marketing to role-players is like no other market out there. It's a very small and exclusive market, even with the mainstream attention it's been getting. We're choosey buggers but loyal. Trying to convince us of new ideas is hard. Want to look at a company that really fucked up? Look at White Wolf and their choice to ditch the setting everyone knows and loves (so much that the MMO that's being made is in the Masquerade setting, not the new one). You're not a very successful as a RPG publisher if you can't sell product...sure, there's WhiteWolf fan boys and they kept the company in business but not as successful as before imo.
