Depends on the state ... also, you can always take some classes at a CC ...
You obviously don't know what you are talking about.
And you're obviously making assumptions on things that
vary from state-to-state! Furthermore, some Community Colleges do
not offer the 3rd/4th year classes required in your 1st/2nd year for some degrees (e.g., engineering, which is
not a traditional bachelors program).
Community Colleges and Universities teach the same material when provided. By this I mean, two honor EGL 101s in both colleges will teach the exact thing,
Not always!
In a few states, what you earn at the community college level is
reduced by one grade point when you use it at the university level. Furthermore, in many states, what is required for AA does
not always translate into what is needed for your BA or, far more often in the case of your, BS.
That's why I
always recommend you enroll at the university, THEN find out what classes you can take at the local community college that WILL COUNT. In the Florida State University system, when you take classes at a CC while enrolled at a University, this is known as being a "transient student." You A) lock in your BA/BS cat and required classes, B) are guaranteed acceptance of your classes towards your degree (with
written sign-off) and C)
you decide which classes you want to take at either (you only need to take 1 class per year at your university in the Florida University System).
With over-crowding in the Florida State University System, the universities "of your choice"
no longer have to accept you if you have an AA from a Florida CC. My Alma Mater closes its doors 2 years before entry, almost 1 year to AA graduates. I've seen too many AA graduates assume they can just walk over and get accepted, and then they find out they either have to wait a year or go to 300 miles away to another SUS location that doesn't close its doors so early.
in fact I've went and conducted a survey, same books, most in all professors have master degrees. Now if the University has a advanced level of honors EGL, then you can't compare what isn't available in this situation.
Every single one of my instructors for all 5 years of my BSE had PhDs --
every single one -- and some from some very prominent EE programs. I will defend my Alma Mater's EE College Board ranking for a reason, and we have such a huge research park that even when I'm over 1,000 miles away, people will see my degree and go "Oh, I wanted to get my Masters from there."
Now if all you're getting is a BSET (Engineering Technology),
that's different! But for a traditional BSE (Engineering), you typically want to go straight to the university.
Do NOT confuse BSET with BSE. Many CCs don't have classes that fit into the ABET program beyond year 1, or only offer them
infrequently. Again, you can
always take CC classes while already enrolled at a university -- but you can
NOT go the other way.
Do you even know why Universities are a lot more expensive? Dormitories, Bachelors Degree, Libraries, More courses, Location, Quantity, Bigger Campus, Bigger Classes, etc...
And research parks.
Most universities, during your first 2 years,
let you take some classes, as you wish, at a local, state community college (paying the CC hourly rate) while enrolled in an university program. Why go to a CC and "wait" to be accepted when you can
get accepted and into a program from Day 1?
Don't think Community College is for people who are "stupid" or what not, most people go to CC because study show it's better to go to a CC first, then transfer to a U.
No, no, NO! Not for my degree! I've seen too many AAs come in to my Alma Mater and they find out basically 30+ of their 60 semester hours don't count towards a BSE. Furthermore, they also find out about 15-21 hours weren't even offered at the CC, which sets them back at least one semester.
Maybe you live in a state or went to a school that isn't ABET accredited, or you're thinking of a BSET. ~40 hours pre-engineering core, ~40 hours engineering core, ~40 hours option last time I checked. A lot of
stupid AA goers think they are "free" to choose their first 60 semester hours, and only have to take certain electives.
NOT for engineering. Engineering technology, yes, or any other BA/BS, yes. But not engineering (BSE).
Where are you getting your information from anyway? Where are your sources to back up your lame accusations about engineers. I think that was a stupid belief you have running there. Go ask a engineer, they would look at you as if fell when you where a baby. And don't say "I'm an engineer", as another that you don't know, and don't apply yourbelief to yourself.
I was on my engineering college's council in my last 2 years of school and I used to advise kids in late high school what was required for a BSE. Most of them where wholly ignorant of what they had to take in CC, and didn't even know about the "transient" option.
I've now traveled (for work) to a dozen other US states, and for every ABET accredited program and college-university system, I've seen it the same as Florida -- with 1 exception: a few state universities knock a point off if you take 2nd or (if they offer them) 3rd year classes at a CC.
A
crapload of studies do NOT include a study of ABET engineering pre-core and core requirements. Engineering is a
major exception at the bachelors level because unlike virtually all other degrees, you do
NOT get to "elect" from for your first 60 hours. Most engineering programs are
very specific, along with the ABET requirements.
There are a lot more links out there that proves that what you are saying makes no sense. Even the engineer part.
Listen to yourself -- "Even the engineer part." I'm sorry, but a BSE is wholly different than any other BA/BS. At the 2 local CCs to my Alma Mater, they only offered the calculus-based statistics course (which only has to be taken by engineers, the other 2 statistics courses -- one for BA, one for BS, both without calculus) were offered only every 2-3 semesters. Why? Because most engineers were at the university level.
Bring me some sources to support your pathetic claims.
I don't have to prove junk. You are free to assume I pull everything out of my ass. Or you can heed the fact that the British were the first to take Engineering and turn it from a post-graduate discipline (like Law or Medicine) and turn it into a
heavily modified undergraduate program -- typically 5 years -- because they felt post-graduate experience was more important (and a 2-3 year internship was not sufficient). That means 80 engineering hours were moved into the BS portion, squashing another 40 hours of pre-core.
This is the essence of the BSE as accredited in the US by ABET.
Engineers are engineers for a reason, and it does require intelligence.
Intelligence, yes, at least an 90 IQ I'd argue. But it doesn't require anything beyond "average" intelligence. It merely requires discipline and a good work ethic. People who think it's "hard" are often complaining about the amount of work and study required.
I'm a BSEE and I consider myself "average" intelligence. I've gone to school with people who clearly were B students themselves in high school like myself. We had to bust our ass while in college, plus we worked 24-40 hours/week at a technical job, so we came out with B/C grades.
We don't always get the right answer on an exam, but when given time and we put forth the effort, we get the right answers for our jobs. We don't settle for "an answer," we want the "right answer." Especially when it comes to corporate revenue or tax pay dollars or, more importantly, human lives.
And a 3.00 in a CC is the same at a UC, unless the student does better, or slacks off.
No, in some states it doesn't count the same.
And no offense, but someone who get an AA that took algebra or finite math with non-calculus chemistry, economics, statistics, physics, etc... as their math/science options doesn't match someone with an AA who clearly did an engineering pre-core with 3-4 semesters of calculus and several semesters of calculus-based chemistry, economics, statistics, physics, etc...
Calculus is
not hard and doesn't require anything but "average" intelligence. But it
does require discipline. It requires you to apply yourself, learning how to use the tools and analyze problems. Those who "slack off" on algebra because they don't see the need and can "get the answer" without seeing the reason for the tool and its methodical approach are the ones that end up failing higher math as well. Sadly, those people are typically those with IQs 125 and above.
Frankly, I think they should teach calculus right after algebra in high school, instead of geometry. If you aren't doing engineering or physics, you honestly don't need trig or trig-based calc. People think calculus is "hard." Calculus is more like "freedom" -- it lets you understand how to describe systems. Because systems are just objects that change, which change other things, etc...
Engineering has always been the study of systems, foremost the application of calculus to describe them.
