Socialism... am I correct? I think I am.

[luvsemlarge]

EXAMPLE #1: I work at the government run factory, making wooden batons for the military and the police. These are used for busting skulls when someone attempts to protest against Socialism. *(Note - These are not sold to the general public.) I am considered an outstanding worker, as I am always on time, never call in sick, and I always do my job at a very high level and I am very productive.

EXAMPLE #2: Dillon, my co-worker is on the same assembly line as me. He has a track record of calling in sick, not being very productive, and makes the same amount of money as I do. He has no desire to move up and gain more responsibility.

Example #3: Luke, another person living in the same tenement (government owned) that Dillom and I live, has decided not to work, as he figures he can go to the store and get the same food as anyone else because WTF... it's free. Why is it free? Because the government owns the farms and has people working on those farms for nothing... well, except for free food.

Conclusion: What is the incentive for ANYONE to want to better themselves by being a better employee, if the other people do so much less and get the same amount of food that I can buy, when I am known at work for being a great employee?

Is this what the hippies here (the OWS crowd) who despise Capitalism, want? Do they want Socialism? I think they do. Because in a socialist society, all the working stiffs are all the same. Nobody can be called GREEDY, because nobody has any fucking money. Except for the government. Listen up you stupid sonofabitches who support the OWS crowd... take a look at Germany when Hitler was placed in charge. Read the history.. Their economy was FUCKED when he was done with them. And by the way... who lived high on the hog during the war? That's right--- Hitler and his cronies. While everyone else fought and searched for scraps of bread.

Finally... FUCK YOU! to the people in here who want to tear down our Capitalist system. :2 cents:

 

[lurkingdirk]

:wtf:

Unrelated to Socialism.

 

[tino99]

The majority of the protesters want MORE capitalism. Those banks would never have been bailed out in a real capitalist society. Now, just like when they were bailed out in the 80s, they will probably be even more risky cause they know they will just get bailout years down the road. That's what happened cause of the bailouts of the 80s. TOO BIG TO FAIL AINT CAPITALISM. America give Capitalism a bad name.

 

[Jagger69]

The scenario your describe is more Marxist than it is Socialist. Pure Socialism is based on government-owned manufacturing and services and does not presume an absolute "from each according to his ability and to each according to his need" philosophy whereas theoretical Communism does. Therefore, your buddy Luke, who chooses not to work, would not necessarily be paid the same (or any) wage as you or any of your co-workers. In a proletarian state, however, he would. That's the quintessential reason that true communism is unworkable. If we were all programmable robots, it would work fine but the human factor makes it untenable as a true economic system.

The truth is, the USA and many other nations are already quite socialistic (some much more than others) and yet the capitalist basis that keeps the economy humming remains solidly in place. Most of the nations of Western Europe and Scandinavia as well as Canada would be excellent examples. Elements of socialism can definitely be introduced into an economic framework that is mainly capitalist in nature without having the sky fall. It's not an "all or nothing" proposition by any means.

 

[luvsemlarge]

 

[feller469]

Is it socialism when the government bails out big businesses who have made horrible business decisions (and doesn't insist the leaders of those businesses be replaced by more competent people)?

 

[emceeemcee]

Socialism is when people who aren't conservatives protest about something

 

[Jagger69]

Is it socialism when the government bails out big businesses who have made horrible business decisions (and doesn't insist the leaders of those businesses be replaced by more competent people)?

Most definitely. A gross perversion of it actually....and the manifestation of the military-industrial complex about which we were appropriately warned so many years ago by President Eisenhower.

 

[ragincaucasian]

Socialism is when people who aren't conservatives protest about something

this - prove me wrong

 

[Rey C.]

EXAMPLE #1: I work at the government run factory, making wooden batons for the military and the police. These are used for busting skulls when someone attempts to protest against Socialism. *(Note - These are not sold to the general public.) I am considered an outstanding worker, as I am always on time, never call in sick, and I always do my job at a very high level and I am very productive.

EXAMPLE #2: Dillon, my co-worker is on the same assembly line as me. He has a track record of calling in sick, not being very productive, and makes the same amount of money as I do. He has no desire to move up and gain more responsibility.

Example #3: Luke, another person living in the same tenement (government owned) that Dillom and I live, has decided not to work, as he figures he can go to the store and get the same food as anyone else because WTF... it's free. Why is it free? Because the government owns the farms and has people working on those farms for nothing... well, except for free food.

Conclusion: What is the incentive for ANYONE to want to better themselves by being a better employee, if the other people do so much less and get the same amount of food that I can buy, when I am known at work for being a great employee?

Is this what the hippies here (the OWS crowd) who despise Capitalism, want? Do they want Socialism? I think they do. Because in a socialist society, all the working stiffs are all the same. Nobody can be called GREEDY, because nobody has any fucking money. Except for the government. Listen up you stupid sonofabitches who support the OWS crowd... take a look at Germany when Hitler was placed in charge. Read the history.. Their economy was FUCKED when he was done with them. And by the way... who lived high on the hog during the war? That's right--- Hitler and his cronies. While everyone else fought and searched for scraps of bread.

Finally... FUCK YOU! to the people in here who want to tear down our Capitalist system. :2 cents:

/Continued...

One day, after calling in sick, Dillon and Luke meet for lunch at a cafe down from the factory. While they're seated at their table, a well dressed man enters. There are no more tables, so he asks to sit with them. They invite him to have a seat. Over coffee, he describes how he is in the area to have a look at a factory that makes batons for the government and police. He'd like to buy it in a leveraged buy-out. They quickly say that the factory he's describing is where they work. Even though they're lazy workers, they know a LOT about the operation. The well dressed man picks up on this. He asks them if they'd like to provide deep intel and help him with the takeover, in exchange for guaranteed management jobs - they don't even have to show up, if they don't want to. They agree. They go to work every day for the next six months, take pictures and gather every bit of info that he asks for.

He launches his bid and uses the company's pension fund and equipment as collateral for the loan. He uses none of his own money. Upon taking over, he installs himself as CEO and Luke and Dillon become operations managers. The CEO pays himself a salary of $10 million/year. Dillon and Luke each make $500K/year. They all have severance agreements in their employment contracts equivalent to two years salary. By the end of year two, it becomes clear to the creditors that the company is rapidly losing money. The board steps in and ****** the CEO out. But he's already sold his shares in the company in a public float and made $60 million. Dillon and Luke are also fired. Two years of easy pay and severance worth another two years pay... not bad! But it's too late for Acme Baton. The company is doomed. It declares Chapter 11. But no one will provide "debtor in possession" financing, so it's rapidly heading for Chapter 7 liquidation. But the government and police need those batons! And this is the biggest baton maker in the world. This firm is "too big to fail".

So the government steps in and provides the debtor in possession financing to expedite the Chapter 11 and prevent liquidation. A new management team is installed and things work out in the end. But what about our heroes? The well dressed man uses the $100 million that he's collected from Acme Baton to buy a house in the Hamptons and pay off his pregnant teen-aged mistress (can't have the wife finding out about her!). He's currently working on another deal... only this time it's a bank. Dillon and Luke? Well, they bought the apartment building where they used to live with a complex commercial real estate loan... no money down, of course. But the $2 million they each made has convinced them that this "new capitalism" that people have fallen in love with is definitely the way to go. They've even decided to write checks to Michele Bachmann in her bid for President. They never cared for her before, but now, her message of "free market solutions" for everything from the housing crisis to cancer makes perfect sense.

The end/

And I do so love happy endings.

 

[luvsemlarge]

/Continued...

One day, after calling in sick, Dillon and Luke meet for lunch at a cafe down from the factory. While they're seated at their table, a well dressed man enters. There are no more tables, so he asks to sit with them. They invite him to have a seat. Over coffee, he describes how he is in the area to have a look at a factory that makes batons for the government and police. He'd like to buy it in a leveraged buy-out. They quickly say that the factory he's describing is where they work. Even though they're lazy workers, they know a LOT about the operation. The well dressed man picks up on this. He asks them if they'd like to provide deep intel and help him with the takeover, in exchange for guaranteed management jobs - they don't even have to show up, if they don't want to. They agree. They go to work every day for the next six months, take pictures and gather every bit of info that he asks for.

He launches his bid and uses the company's pension fund and equipment as collateral for the loan. He uses none of his own money. Upon taking over, he installs himself as CEO and Luke and Dillon become operations managers. The CEO pays himself a salary of $10 million/year. Dillon and Luke each make $500K/year. They all have severance agreements in their employment contracts equivalent to two years salary. By the end of year two, it becomes clear to the creditors that the company is rapidly losing money. The board steps in and ****** the CEO out. But he's already sold his shares in the company in a public float and made $60 million. Dillon and Luke are also fired. Two years of easy pay and severance worth another two years pay... not bad! But it's too late for Acme Baton. The company is doomed. It declares Chapter 11. But no one will provide "debtor in possession" financing, so it's rapidly heading for Chapter 7 liquidation. But the government and police need those batons! And this is the biggest baton maker in the world. This firm is "too big to fail".

So the government steps in and provides the debtor in possession financing to expedite the Chapter 11 and prevent liquidation. A new management team is installed and things work out in the end. But what about our heroes? The well dressed man uses the $100 million that he's collected from Acme Baton to buy a house in the Hamptons and pay off his pregnant teen-aged mistress (can't have the wife finding out about her!). He's currently working on another deal... only this time it's a bank. Dillon and Luke? Well, they bought the apartment building where they used to live with a complex commercial real estate loan... no money down, of course. But the $2 million they each made has convinced them that this "new capitalism" that people have fallen in love with is definitely the way to go. They've even decided to write checks to Michele Bachmann in her bid for President. They never cared for her before, but now, her message of "free market solutions" for everything from the housing crisis to cancer makes perfect sense.

The end.

And I do so love happy endings.

Unfortunately, you failed to understand that private enterprises are not allowed in communist / socialist systems. Yout scenario is but a *****... a ***** many in socialist countries only ***** of.

 

[Rey C.]

Unfortunately, you failed to understand that private enterprises are not allowed in communist / socialist systems. Yout scenario is but a *****... a ***** many in socialist countries only ***** of.

There are many, many things which I fail to understand: medicine, astro-physics, marriage, ********, how to maintain a happy, long term relationship, etc. Lots of things. But on business and economics, generally speaking, I think I'm fairly well versed on those topics.

Your statement is blatantly incorrect. Have you not heard of Foxconn Technology Group? There are thousands of private enterprises in China and other communist countries. Considering the trade deficit this nation has been running for twenty plus years, you really should know that.

Further, you need to understand the differences between economic systems (socialism, capitalism, corporatism, etc.) and governmental systems (communism, democracies, monarchies, etc.). With that understanding, it will be much easier to understand how and why there can be socialist democracies and communist governments that allow and employ (managed) capitalism.

As the **** say these days, "don't get it twisted."

 

[vodkazvictim]

FOR FUCK'S SAKE! RESEARCH SOCIALISM BEFORE COMMENTING ON IT!!!!!!!!!!


That is all.

 

[feller469]

It has been socialism for the 1% for a long time. They keep the money and the power, and funnel the ***** of capitalism to the other 99%. Orwell, Eisenhower, et al, spoke of it,

 

[Trident1]

Socialism i.e. Nanny State/Government run entities = waste, inefficient, overburdened, bloated, poorly run and maintained.

 

[sid-sexy]

I say Fuck everyone who wants to pretend that people want to tear down capitalism in order to divert the public's attention from the fact that unregulated capitalism breeds absurd inequity and damages the value of society.

 

[Patrick_S]

[No message]

 

[Patrick_S]

I just love it when people who don't have a fucking clue what they're talking about start political threads. Funnily enough these posters almost always are conservative americans.

 

[Facetious]

Is it socialism when the government bails out big businesses who have made horrible business decisions (and doesn't insist the leaders of those businesses be replaced by more competent people)?

Sounds more like ''collusion-ism'' to me.

 

[BigSwede]

Unfortunately, you failed to understand that private enterprises are not allowed in communist / socialist systems. Yout scenario is but a *****... a ***** many in socialist countries only ***** of.

In socialdemocracies private enterprises are certainly allowed.
You seem to be under the impression that all socialist countries are dictatorships.