US land of the free?

This is a thesis I just thought of to raise the quality level of this board.

For a long time, the USA has called itself the land of the free. If you wanted to do something and weren't allowed to do it in your own country, you went to the US. In the US you could believe what you wanted to believe. In the US you could settle wherever you wanted to settle. In the US you could say whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted.

But is this still true? These days, one can follow any religion one wants to in any country in the in the western world and one can say whatever one wants to say in every country in the western world.

Only 40 years ago, one wasn't allowed to say out loud that one was a communist in the US. This person would then be sent to jail. In the US, in every state except Nevada, prostitution is forbidden and so is the use or possession of marijuana. Even though that last one is also forbidden in most other western countries, prostitution is either allowed or condoned.

In the 30's, the US tried to prohibit drinking and even though the US turned back on this policy after only a few years, it was a clear sign that things were slowly changing in the us. Today one has to be 21 before one can legally drink. In most countries that age is 18.

The right to settle wherever one wants to has not been revoked as far as I know, but since there's almost no piece of unclaimed or protected land left even in the US this right is empty.

In only 6 states of the US same-sex marriages are granted while same-sex marriage and some or all other kinds of same-sex unions are prohibited in a grand total of 18 states in the US.

Concerning abortion. 6 states have trigger laws and 3 other states have laws intending on criminalizing abortion.

Because of all of this, one can only conclude that the US is no longer the land of the free and if the US claims it is, it only does so to fool the ignorant.

I wish everyone a happy discussion.


(PS. This is only a thesis to ignite a decent discussion. If you've got nothing to add or disprove, please don't reply!)
 

jasonk282

Banned
Oh God this is going to get real HEATED. As a US Army veteran served for 10 years, I guess my view point is biased. I will add that regardless of the positives and negatives of this Country, there are some negatives, I would not chose a better place to live or defend. So we have done a lot of things right and a few thing wrong, but I love this country with all my heart and would not want my family to live in any other place.
 
I live in the UK and in some ways it's a freer country than the US and in some ways it's not as free.
It's different partly because we have no Constitution (we had a Bill of Rights back in 1689 though) so in essence we can do anything unless a law has been passed to prevent it.We don't have such silliness as your alcohol laws (like having an open container in a car, restrictions on moving beer between states for example); on the other hand it's difficult to own guns but then nobody I know has the slightest interest in having one or any need for it.
 
Most of the shackles to our "freedom" have been the result of Christianity's influence (like with the attempts to prohibit sins like booze, prostitution, samesex marriage, abortion).

Today, the shackles to our freedom have been put on by Corporations and the Gov't's warped sense of combating terrorism (i.e. The Patriot Act).
 
This is a thesis I just thought of to raise the quality level of this board.

For a long time, the USA has called itself the land of the free. If you wanted to do something and weren't allowed to do it in your own country, you went to the US. In the US you could believe what you wanted to believe. In the US you could settle wherever you wanted to settle. In the US you could say whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted.

But is this still true? These days, one can follow any religion one wants to in any country in the in the western world and one can say whatever one wants to say in every country in the western world.

Only 40 years ago, one wasn't allowed to say out loud that one was a communist in the US. This person would then be sent to jail. In the US, in every state except Nevada, prostitution is forbidden and so is the use or possession of marijuana. Even though that last one is also forbidden in most other western countries, prostitution is either allowed or condoned.

In the 30's, the US tried to prohibit drinking and even though the US turned back on this policy after only a few years, it was a clear sign that things were slowly changing in the us. Today one has to be 21 before one can legally drink. In most countries that age is 18.

The right to settle wherever one wants to has not been revoked as far as I know, but since there's almost no piece of unclaimed or protected land left even in the US this right is empty.

In only 6 states of the US same-sex marriages are granted while same-sex marriage and some or all other kinds of same-sex unions are prohibited in a grand total of 18 states in the US.

Concerning abortion. 6 states have trigger laws and 3 other states have laws intending on criminalizing abortion.

Because of all of this, one can only conclude that the US is no longer the land of the free and if the US claims it is, it only does so to fool the ignorant.

I wish everyone a happy discussion.


(PS. This is only a thesis to ignite a decent discussion. If you've got nothing to add or disprove, please don't reply!)

You make a lot of good points but the country is probably better now freedom wise then it ever has been.Wasn't all the free for many since the beginning.We had slaves,women were not equals (no rights,basically viewed as property of husbands) etc.

But of course you are right we still have a lot of work to do on things like prostituion and drug laws.


And just one correction,prohibition was passed around 1920 and ended after the election of FDR in the early 30s much to the consternation of people like AL Capone.
 
Oh God this is going to get real HEATED.

If that's what's going to happen I've done my job well. Much better than those fart, the my gf's pussy does(n't) smell, the look at my gf, I hate Obama/Bush even though I can't give any decent reason, etc. threads.
 
Founded as the antithesis to political oppression (thou haven't believe what you believe) the United Emirates of Amerigo have overturned their original principles (thou must believe or else)

Too bad ... The majority of US citizens now defines liberailsm as zealotry. And vice cersa...

I don't get it! Do you? .... :confused: ....
 
It really depends of your conception of freedom. According to Isaiah Berlin, there are two basic conceptions:

Negative freedom: The absence of external constrainst.
Positive/effective freedom: The ability to actually use that absence.

I think, the US being an anti-state neoliberalist country, scores high on the negative freedom. The fact that you're allowed to have guns proved that point.
But the downside is, that certain negative freedom's can downside the effective freedoms of people. Because someone has the right to shoot me when I enter their garden at night, I'm not free to ask for the way home when I'm lost at night.
The problem is that the freedom of A may be a zero-sum game with the freedom of B.
In europe the focus is more on positive freedom, that's what socialism is all about, make sure that the people are able to make use of their freedoms.
 

Spleen

Banned?
It's a lot of things, but it definately isn't free. Doesn't seem very United, either.
 

Ace Bandage

The one and only.
Another year-old bump. Is it zombie thread day? Why didn't I get the fucking memo? :mad:
 
People are in a zombie mode after watching The Walking Dead last night. So yes. It is zombie day.
 

Supafly

Retired Mod
Bronze Member
Since the Senate passed the 'Homeland Security Act', and you even lost the 'Habeas Corpus', you are no more any kind of 'Land of the Free'

And as long as Obama does not take action to get that away, you stay not much better than China or Russia.

Plus: China pretty much owns your country, by debt.
 

xfire

New Twitter/X @cxffreeman
tldr

Will say that America is still the land of opportunity if you're not lazy or stupid. Either one of those will fuck you pretty hard, though.
 

Legzman

what the fuck you lookin at?
This country is overdue for a revolution. "We the People" need to take back our country. I don't mean marching on washington with signs and protesting. I'm talking a couple million people taking up arms and then marching on washington...

 
we are free!! until they say porn is illegal and jerking off will put you in prison for 25 to life, make mine america :nanner:
 

shimmy2

Approved Content Owner
Approved Content Owner
for a long time i didn't really like america... until i left it and lived in some other countries. god damn i was happy when i came back home. yes you're under surveillance and scrutiny, many areas are gestapo like police states, and the economy has been sucking dick for a long time... but at least we have luxuries like hot running water, indoor plumbing, a fairly decent interstate highway system, uninterrupted electricity, and minimum wage.

i've lived in places where they don't have these things and until the basic of taking a hot shower, driving on a freeway versus ungraded/unpaved/unmarked dirt roads, and having your power stay on for more than a few hours at a time are taken away from you then you don't know how fortunate you are to be here. i'm sure there are some places that are better by default but I've only been to US/Canada/Japan/Singapore and other parts of asia so educate me.
 

Spleen

Banned?
for a long time i didn't really like america... until i left it and lived in some other countries. god damn i was happy when i came back home. yes you're under surveillance and scrutiny, many areas are gestapo like police states, and the economy has been sucking dick for a long time... but at least we have luxuries like hot running water, indoor plumbing, a fairly decent interstate highway system, uninterrupted electricity, and minimum wage.

i've lived in places where they don't have these things and until the basic of taking a hot shower, driving on a freeway versus ungraded/unpaved/unmarked dirt roads, and having your power stay on for more than a few hours at a time are taken away from you then you don't know how fortunate you are to be here. i'm sure there are some places that are better by default but I've only been to US/Canada/Japan/Singapore and other parts of asia so educate me.

Japan and Singapore have running water, indoor plumbing, a highway system, electricity and minimum wage. Where are you talking about?
 
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