vodkazvictim
Why save the world, when you can rule it?
I was standing outside a shop in Leicester so the guy I was with could smoke out of the wind when a Moslem missionary type wandered up and had a brief conversation with me.
He never actually told me to convert, our conversation was pretty much summed up by his parting sentence:
"think about who the number one creator is" (something I find odd considering that I assumed Islam believes in only one creator, therefore there can't be a number one, but only one).
He was polite, not aggressive or intimidating.
Now there are some people who claim that Britain is overrun with Moslems (as tho they were rats) and that we have no control over them, but consider this;
The guy didn't succeed in altering my beliefs a bit and he didn't try too hard.
In fact he acted pretty much just the same as the american missionaries who frequently wander the streets of Leeds attempting to convert Leodians to christianity (Christianity has lost much ground in Leeds - old churches lie unfrequented these days and one has even been turned into a nightclub! Talk about sacriledge!)
So why am I not angry with this guy? Why do I not view him as a heathen invader attempting to take over and morally corrupt my country, for which (in spite of it's vast number of negative achievements) I do still have a certain pride for?
Because it's a dialogue: I allow him to speak, to use words and persuasion rather than much more forcefull tactics. My country allows him to speak and in return all he does is speak.
Because there is a dialogue both of us benefit; we have a civilised atmosphere and neither of us has to resort to such extreme measures as appear when there is no dialogue.
The ancient chinese got some things spot on, and they were spot on with the yinyang :yinyang: Everything is action and reaction and society, like so many other things is like a giant pendulum; pushing it one way only results in it swinging back the other way. The harder and faster you push it, the harder and faster it swings back.
Those that live by the sword die by the sword, remember?
Another benefit of dialogue is that it allows us to get to the truth.
With rabid reactionary statements and biassed guarding of sides you get nowhere near the truth:
Each side defends it's argument aggressively, knowing that there is no point giving an inch of ground (however wrong they may be) because there is no chance their opposite number will seed any ground. The inevitable result is a deadlock which satisfies nobody.
Now there are those people who say that Britain is overrun with Moslems and that they run Britain.
But if that is so why does Britain continue to tow americas line, rather than siding with the Moslem nations (that are in any case far from united).
Why does Britain still wage war in Moslem lands?
Those that accuse Britain of being a Moslem patsy are the reactionaries who won't give an inch even when they know themselves to be wrong.
Without a dialogue you deny Moslems a voice. If Moslems have no peacefull dialogue with which to defend themselves, then they are by default forced to resort to other options and so the spectre of religious violence arises, because, without any peacefull options, Moslems may feel that aggression is the only option.
In some sub-saharan conflicts in Africa we've even seen Buddhists talking about when the right time is to kill.
Before the Soviets were dragged into Afghanistan to fight for their "allies" Afghan women didn't have to wear the vale, it was a democracy and was trying to move forward; evil begets evil, violence begets violence and yin begets yang.
Push the pendulum left and it will swing back right.
Yin leads to yang and yan to ying. :yinyang:
To recap:
1: Dialogue is better than hardheaded uncompromising shouting.
2: Moslems are just the same as Christians and while neither religion has an unblemished track record, neither is pure evil
3: :yinyang:
I just wanted to say this to try to enlighten those who regard England as a country "overrun by Islam". If we were overrun there would be no dialogue: I would have been converted or I would be dead.
Since Moslems can be of any race, I don't wanna see this turn into a race war thread, so take notice: No racially inflammatory bullshit! :flame:
:yinyang:
He never actually told me to convert, our conversation was pretty much summed up by his parting sentence:
"think about who the number one creator is" (something I find odd considering that I assumed Islam believes in only one creator, therefore there can't be a number one, but only one).
He was polite, not aggressive or intimidating.
Now there are some people who claim that Britain is overrun with Moslems (as tho they were rats) and that we have no control over them, but consider this;
The guy didn't succeed in altering my beliefs a bit and he didn't try too hard.
In fact he acted pretty much just the same as the american missionaries who frequently wander the streets of Leeds attempting to convert Leodians to christianity (Christianity has lost much ground in Leeds - old churches lie unfrequented these days and one has even been turned into a nightclub! Talk about sacriledge!)
So why am I not angry with this guy? Why do I not view him as a heathen invader attempting to take over and morally corrupt my country, for which (in spite of it's vast number of negative achievements) I do still have a certain pride for?
Because it's a dialogue: I allow him to speak, to use words and persuasion rather than much more forcefull tactics. My country allows him to speak and in return all he does is speak.
Because there is a dialogue both of us benefit; we have a civilised atmosphere and neither of us has to resort to such extreme measures as appear when there is no dialogue.
The ancient chinese got some things spot on, and they were spot on with the yinyang :yinyang: Everything is action and reaction and society, like so many other things is like a giant pendulum; pushing it one way only results in it swinging back the other way. The harder and faster you push it, the harder and faster it swings back.
Those that live by the sword die by the sword, remember?
Another benefit of dialogue is that it allows us to get to the truth.
With rabid reactionary statements and biassed guarding of sides you get nowhere near the truth:
Each side defends it's argument aggressively, knowing that there is no point giving an inch of ground (however wrong they may be) because there is no chance their opposite number will seed any ground. The inevitable result is a deadlock which satisfies nobody.
Now there are those people who say that Britain is overrun with Moslems and that they run Britain.
But if that is so why does Britain continue to tow americas line, rather than siding with the Moslem nations (that are in any case far from united).
Why does Britain still wage war in Moslem lands?
Those that accuse Britain of being a Moslem patsy are the reactionaries who won't give an inch even when they know themselves to be wrong.
Without a dialogue you deny Moslems a voice. If Moslems have no peacefull dialogue with which to defend themselves, then they are by default forced to resort to other options and so the spectre of religious violence arises, because, without any peacefull options, Moslems may feel that aggression is the only option.
In some sub-saharan conflicts in Africa we've even seen Buddhists talking about when the right time is to kill.
Before the Soviets were dragged into Afghanistan to fight for their "allies" Afghan women didn't have to wear the vale, it was a democracy and was trying to move forward; evil begets evil, violence begets violence and yin begets yang.
Push the pendulum left and it will swing back right.
Yin leads to yang and yan to ying. :yinyang:
To recap:
1: Dialogue is better than hardheaded uncompromising shouting.
2: Moslems are just the same as Christians and while neither religion has an unblemished track record, neither is pure evil
3: :yinyang:
I just wanted to say this to try to enlighten those who regard England as a country "overrun by Islam". If we were overrun there would be no dialogue: I would have been converted or I would be dead.
Since Moslems can be of any race, I don't wanna see this turn into a race war thread, so take notice: No racially inflammatory bullshit! :flame:
:yinyang:
